What about Ukraine and Russia?

Discussion in 'Free Speech Alley' started by Winston1, Feb 13, 2022.

  1. Winston1

    Winston1 Founding Member

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    So what happens next? Do the Russians invade and war erupts? Do they back off? What are the consequences of a war between Russia and Ukraine? What does the US and NATO do in response to an attack? What happens to the economy, ours and the world’s?
    What should the US do to stop an invasion or if it happens? How did we get in this position?
    This has been something years in the making and has fallen across the terms of multiple presidents of both parties. Please don’t bother with if the old tropes....”It’s Biden’s/Trump’s fault as if either is singularly responsible, because they’re not. Yes each bears some responsibility but it’s really a problem of how the west doesn’t understand or properly address thugs who run Russia, China and other similar autocracies. This article presents an interesting point of view. What do you all think?
    https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/02/lavrov-russia-diplomacy-ukraine/622075/
     
  2. LSUpride123

    LSUpride123 PureBlood

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    Awww, all the Dems money laundering in Ukraine is about to go belly up.

    Funny we can send troops to their map lines but not ours.
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    [​IMG]
     
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  3. shane0911

    shane0911 Helping lost idiots find their village

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    Too bad 45 isn't there, this shit wouldn't be an issue at all
     
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  4. Kikicaca

    Kikicaca Meaux

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    Send in the president of the insurrection you fear so much a hole
    gettyimages-1230476327.jpg
     
  5. Winston1

    Winston1 Founding Member

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    Yes he was so tough on
    So let’s see if this is what you mean by tough.
    Immediately upon entering the White House, Trump tried to lift Obama-era sanctions and return diplomatic compounds seized by the United States due to interference in the 2016 election. Months later, Congress drew up a bill to strengthen Russia sanctions and prevent Trump from lifting them. The administration lobbied hard against the legislation. When it passed with a veto-proof majority, Trump issued a statementexpressing displeasure — and signaling that enforcement would be lax.
    His administration has done exactly that. It delayed implementing the law and missed key deadlines, grudgingly conceding only after intervention by congressional leaders.
    Of course letting Russia return as an influence in Syria and the Middle East for the first time since Gulf War I is another example of his toughness. Or is it undermining NATO or acting like a submissive every time he met with Putin? So much toughness I’m sure Vlad was shaking in his boots….laughing.
     
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  6. Winston1

    Winston1 Founding Member

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    To try and get past this back and forth bullshit I’m going to summarize the article I first noted.
    The point of the article is that Putin and his compadres aren’t the traditional politicians and diplomats but are more like mob bosses and thugs. That means traditional diplomacy doesn’t work. Traditionally diplomatic relations even between adversaries follow patterns and both sides expect to find some middle ground.
    Putin era Russian “diplomacy” is a tool to use as a way to intimidate and obfuscate its targets. They only recognize force and the willingness to use it. They don’t believe the west will fight for anything but an invasion of NATO. They believe they can isolate and cut off outside states.
    There’s evidence supporting this beginning with the war with Georgia when W was president through invasion of Crimea and continuing assault both military and economic under Obama and Trump.
    The suggestion by the author are interesting and carry risk but maybe less risk than continuing the current process.
     
  7. kluke

    kluke Founding Member

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    I agree with the analysis of Russia but I don't see it as a new development. The things that push a Russian leader to the top develop these 'skills' and encourage ruthless ambition. They also don't care if their people suffer because of their ambitions. Bush and Obama naively thought they were dealing with normal leaders and got hosed, especially Obama. Trump never seem to make the connection that the USA benefits most from a peaceful ordered world.
    Putin sees this as the continuation of the 'Cold War'. Russia lost battles over the last few decades but it ain't over till Putin says its over. With Biden in the White House, . . . I don't have a lot of hope this ends well. The key is NATO unity in the sanctions area which is complicated.
     
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  8. shane0911

    shane0911 Helping lost idiots find their village

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    Man tell me about it. I lost count of how many wars he got us into...oh wait, that was 0
     
  9. Rex

    Rex Founding Member

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    If Putin invades Ukraine he will dramatically increase his chances of being strung up like Mussolini.
     
  10. Jmg

    Jmg Veteran Member

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    he was tough on russia. the dipshit TDS media sold you a lie about russia and trump. maybe the dumbest and most pervasive media lie i have ever seen, until the media got together to downplay lab leak theory.
     

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