When did republicans come into the discussion on this point? I must have missed the memo because I thought we were discussing Americans. Regardless, you oversimplify and vilify an entire party. Very much expected. What are your stats? First generation? Practically the entire country is made up of immigrants, including my own family. The very foundation of the country is immigration. As to "an inflated view of my country due to nostalgia, defensiveness and ignorance", insulting me won't displace much water. Guessing at your age based upon your posts(college student correct?), I won't put much stock in what you type here from now on. I'm more inclined to listen to somebody that's been in the game(like me), instead of still playing games, in school. There certainly are. I have been to many of them, and still maintain that America offers more opportunity. How did I know this? Yes, poverty is sad. And big, bad 'ol America(oops, I meant the republicans) are doing everything they can to perpetuate poverty. It's just terrible here. I would much rather be in poverty in Costa Rica. At least their beaches are nice. Curious to read where anyone in this thread claimed we should not strive to be better? I missed that part. And do I think that America is a better place to live than Norway, Iceland, Australia, Canada, Ireland, Sweden, Switzerland, Japan, Netherlands, France, and Finland?Yes and I have been to 5 of those countries. How many have you seen? And if you are basing the value of your country upon a survey done by the United Nations, I would suggest you get out more. Of course, after you get your diploma and with out any help from mom and dad. Therein lies the rub. And the best of luck to you in your search for a good country. Sounds like there are a lot of options for you.
whats the thread entitled? recap--obama sux because he will raise your taxes, i think the super rich's taxes need to be raised so they the burden of making this country better can be shared equitably. and sorry about vilifying an entire party, but i kinda have to in this venue. i have a problem with the political philosophy of the current GOP, not with individual republicans necessarily. i often villify the democratic party too (just not on this board, because there is enough of that). i am not a democrat. i didnt generate the stats. we were having a discussion, so i did a quick online check and linked the source. i dont think you can say america is by far the best country because it happened to be sparsely populated 300 yrs ago, nor hold it against others that they have been populated for 1500 yrs. im debating system of govt, not geographical luck. half of fiji's population is 1st gen Indian immigrants. does that make fiji better than the US? every word of what i write isnt directed at you. i would guess though that your inflated view of the US comes from one of the three reasons i mentioned (off the top of my head). and they werent meant to be insulting. ignorance would largely come from lack of experience of other countries and knowledge of history---one should not be offended by either. are you insulting me?:grin: no, ive been out of lsu for a while. although i think life got tons easier after college---til kids. ive been to a few myself, but i think most visits to other countries dont really qualify one to make a good assesment of the greatness of that country. ive been to canada mexico and australia enough to make an informed decision and id put the greatness of canada and australia on par with the US. that's a ringing endorsement of the greatest country in the world---being poor in the US is better than being poor in Costa Rica. and its just too bad that poverty isnt sad enough for the superrich to pay more taxes than me. wow. i dont think you are calmer than i am.
The thread notwithstanding, we were talking about Americans and our responsibility to make the country better. I didn't derail the thread. Which in no way disputes my claim that our country is dominated by immigration - from start to finish. And immigrants are allowed to prosper here, with more opportunity than other countries, and on a much larger scale. I can say that, and did. You can disagree. See how it works? Regardless, immigrants have ample opportunity here. It doesn't matter if it's a cumulative effect or not. No, the US is better because there is more opportunity for it's immigrants and citizens. Go ask the Fijians if they would like to come on over. They probably would. Perhaps, but you quoted me and spoke directly to me as you lumped me in with the masses. That's why I responded. And that would be an uneducated guess on your part. I could say that I thought you were probably retarded based on your inability to reason, but you shouldn't get offended, you just happen to be retarded. Sounds kind of uneducated and insulting, right? Calling somebody ignorant is an insult whether it is your intent or not. I can't help it if you don't understand the English language and its common usage. I was taking a jab at you, and if you are much older than I thought, I apologize. When you commented about not being allowed to resell your Georgia tickets in another thread, I guessed you to be a student. That may well be true, but you are again assuming the length of my stay in those countries, or the purpose. Actually it is, in a very oversimplified way. Poverty exists around the world. Where do you think the majority of the world's poor would prefer to be if they had a choice? Assumptions again. But I still wish you the best in your search. :yelwink2:
Was it Carlin (RIP) that said, "one of the greatest things about this country is the ability to LEAVE it". Just sayin. If its such a bad place. I've been around the world a few times and I know without a doubt its the TOPS. IMHO of course, before the gumbo man starts asking me for stats and crap like that.
im getting weary of this argument, but here it goes anyway. i trust stats more than my own observations in other countries and certainly more than someone else's observations. that quote adds nothing to the argument. i know he was a comedian, but you posted it. how many countries can you not leave? do you really want to say that the one of the main reasons the US is great is because it is not like NKorea, Myanmar and Cuba? boy, carlin had some high standards.
Gumborue, I'd argue that the US is probably more stable than most of the other countries on that list. When the sh*t hits the fan in any of the countries listed, I imagine the US would best be able to absorb the blow.
1. The difference between the top country and the US is 6 points out of 1000. 2. None of the countries listed ahead of the US approaches the population of the US. Bigger countries have bigger non-western and immigrant populations that bring down the averages. 3. Among them only France and Netherlands have significant immigrant populations and it is still half what the US has. 4. All of those countries have very high taxes to pay for socialized medicine and housing which prop up their numbers. 5. None of those countries pay for a space agency or a worldwide military defense, much less pay the amounts of foreign aid or global disaster assistance that the US does. Six of those eleven countries (Norway, France, Netherlands, Japan, Australia, Canada) are reliant on a military alliance with the US to simply defend themselves. Iceland is totally dependent on the US for military protection. 7. None of those countries has a democracy and economy that has been stable for over two centuries. Are you going to invest your money in Ireland or Iceland? Five of those countries (Norway, Japan, France, Netherlands, Finland) have been invaded and occupied in the last 60 years. Two others (Iceland , Australia) have been militarily defended from invasion by US military forces. Two more (Canada, Ireland) have been indirectly defended by the presence of the US. Bottom line: There are tradeoffs to be made and I think America has made most of the right ones. The US is definitely top dog among countries and the place where half the world wants to live. Not perfect, but still the best of the best. Optimus Optimorum
You da man Red. One day when I have absolutely nothing better to do I want to be able to look stuff up like that :grin:. Sounds like someone should be contacting a travel agent soon. I would be happy to find those for anyone not wishing to be here.
my argument has always been that the US is not a clear cut greatest country in the world. your point makes my point. size of a country doesnt factor in. if it does then china is the best, or, well, how do you weigh their negatives against their positive population well, i'll bring up australia because i know more about it than any of the others--in 2001 23% were born in a foreign country. thats pretty significant, although i still dont know how that makes a country great. if the US is the greatest country and then pat buchanan were elected prez and promptly stopped immigration, would the US then not be the greatest country? id say no. thats kinda the point. the main factor in believing the US is not clearly the greatest country is the lives of the bottom 1/4. clearly the US has the largest economy, and it is quite stable. clearly the US has a large and very active shock military. im sure clearly the US military is the most $$$ but probably not the largest. and cant definitively say the best, because of the china #s (but id bet on the US). all this contributes to the greatness of a country, but doesnt make a country the greatest. oh, and about the global aid, not quite. if you go by straight dollar amounts, youre sort of right. japan was giving more for a while there but not any more. also if you consider the EU a country then its not even close. or if you look at giving as a % of GDP then the US is hosed by numerous countries. (not sure how private giving factors in to this.) ok, some points for being around for 200 yrs, but it aint the be all end all. it doesnt mean much about how great a country is NOW. great britain has been around quite a bit longer, are they greater NOW because of it? i think the bottom 1/4 of americans have worse lives than the bottom 1/4 of citizens of several other countries. that puts a question on the undisputed greatness of our nation. half the world also thinks that all the women in the US look like lindsay lohan and jessica alba, that the US doesnt need vaccinations and that there are never any power outages (all of these are real surprises about this country expressed to me by well-educated, smart second-worlders while living here). what half the world (particularly the more misinformed/uneducated half) doesnt mean much---except that it will continue to keep america great with a consistent influx of the best people the world has to offer. clearly the US is a great country. i am quite happy here. but this aint about me, or really you or any TF posters
