Don't want you to get the impression that I am piling on, because that certainly is not my intent but why don't you answer his question? You obviously agree that the statements from the pulpit are invalid and unacceptable, but you took issue with the mention of Obama's Muslim ties as if it were meaningless, and that "75% of Americans condemn the Muslim religion." Where do you get these statistics and why is it meaningless? The fact remains, regardless of how tenuous it may be painted, he has been educated in a Muslim school. Not many Christians can claim the same thing, so it certainly merits mentioning. Combined that with the severely hate filled rhetoric of his Christian adviser, it's has a great many people scratching there heads. And the people asking questions are not the racists Americans who were not voting for him anyway. He didn't lose those votes. He never had them. But he is losing votes currently and this recent dust up has significantly contributed. It's the moderate voter considering him despite his race or inexperience, that is leaving the ship. Remember, you have to have votes on your side, before you can lose them. I think Obama is a likable guy and possibly as qualified as many others to run the country. Certainly in another ten years, few people could argue with that. However, it is not unreasonable to question the man about his views, stances, or lack there of and judge him on that basis. I am uncomfortable with Bush's religious zeal while in office and I think he has had some difficulty separating the two. I get the impression that the country does not want to see this anymore, even if it comes from the other side. Obama may not be professing these motivations, but the country is going to wonder based upon the closeness of this relationship and they have a right to do so without being called racist or intolerant of religions.
i have always believed there is a difference between how we worship - which is basically how we are told to do so - as children, than how we choose to worship as adults. the church i was raised in and (as has been pointed out) dragged to as a child and even into my teens i rejected long ago. when i started examining my beliefs and the teachings of the church i was raised in, i realized that the two did not mesh. even now, tho i dont belong to a particular religion/church there are a couple i identify more with than others. however, there are still teachings/beliefs that i do not agree with even in those churches. i suspect that many of strongly disagree with some part of the teachings of their church. however, one stays connected with the church because they do identify with other beliefs.
well, i havent even heard the sermon with this, and i havent heard any of the sermons entirely so i dont know where wright was going. but, i'd imagine it was used as an example of america's heavy hand. the beginning (in actuality well into it) of american imperialism. we are the big dog. we do a lot to maintain status quo. that includes quelling revolutions by the people, supporting tyrants and/or installing despots. some say alqueda has it in for us because of political meddling, religious suppression and of course backing israel.
There was a poll USAToday as a matter of fact, that I will find that said over half to 75% of Americans, that where polled had a negative view about Islam. It was about 2 years ago and I having difficulty finding. You can say your not piling on, but I think differently, why would you press me to answer a question as to question my credibility like I just go out of my way to post false information here, when I back many of my post up with links to the information? Here is a poll similar to that but not the same percentages, not the USAToday Poll http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/03/08/AR2006030802221.html The school was not a Muslim school, CNN proved that in their investigation, it was a mixed religious school with Christians and Muslims alike. They even went to the school to see for themselves, but I guess you missed that. But since you are doubtful about my post here you go. http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/01/22/obama.madrassa/index.html (source #1 of this post) The fact is that you are linking the viewpoint that he is some sort of secret muslim which would be negative in this presidential race. And it is meaningless to me, him being raised in a muslim culture doesnt matter to me one bit. However, if you deny that Islam is viewed in a negative light in this country, you would be wrong. After his speech, I read alot of blogs and watched a lot of news coverage and a great number of people went back to his side and said that they would vote for him again. So although he may be losing votes, he is gaining alot as well. What would be the difference in 10 years from now? There isnt really a criteria in experience to being the president, that is highly subjective and you are pushing that theory right here. In 10 years from now he would be ready in your mind, but right now he is ready. I havent mentioned race one time here as being some kind of crutch of why he cant be elected, people do have the right to question his ties and motives, but to deny that his race doesnt have anything to do with alot of peoples feelings is to deny that this country has had and still has a problem with racism and discrimination.
That's a valid point. For example homosexuals and women are not afforded the same rights in all churches and that certainly equates to discrimination. No doubt there are some people that don't necessarily agree with that exclusion and still remain a part of that particular church, but probably not as many as you think. Most people that stay in a church, tend to agree with the general direction of that church. Issues like, sexual preference, race, and gender are pretty much flagship ideals when it comes down to it and hard to believe you could fundamentally disagree with them and still remain a part of the congregation. I don't think I could, and really consider myself to be rather tolerant. And if that is true of most people, can the vitriolic speeches that dominate this particular church go unnoticed? Especially for a nationally aspiring politician that runs on a platform of inclusiveness? It seems to be a conflict to me, and although I have not reached any conclusions about it, the explanations given so far don't appear logical. I suspect it is this way for many swing voters today.
Dude, I respect you post, but please pull back on speaking for the majority. Because its just your opinion and you cant speak for others on what you would do or have observed. Thats a very small sample you would be speaking of.
I grow very weary of people outside and inside our country "hating" it.:cry: Find a problem that exists in the world and you'll probably find someone who blames America for it. Funny how you never see these people leaving our country and we can't process immigrants (legal and otherwise) fast enough. I'll take our country despite all that is "wrong" with it over any other place in this world.
I agree wholeheartedly with this. We dont have to sit around and worry about suicide bombings and where the next meal is coming from and famine. We are definitely privileged in this country and I am honored to be apart of this great nation.
All I asked for was validation of a quoted statistic. That is reasonable and not uncommon. You can take it personally if you choose. Thanks for posting this and I suppose I did miss it in a way. Truth is, it didn't bother me so I never tried to prove it or disprove it. I was wrong to regurtitate incorrect information. No, actually I was not doing that. He claims to be a Christian and there is some dispute because of his earlier education with Muslims. They seem to be in conflict and that's all I pointed out - not that he is a Muslim. I don't deny this, nor have I, and therefor this point of yours is meaningless. I'm happy you think so, but I have not seen this reaction from the polls. Blogs are about as accurate as the views expressed here. Perhaps the numbers will shift back for Obama. As of yet, I have not seen this happen. Then by your logic, a twelve year old with 170 IQ, studying politics at Harvard should do just fine. Yes, it is highly subjective at to what type of experience you have had, and where it's coming from. That does not change the fact that this is the primary issue with this candidate. This more than anything will keep him out of office. And that is your opinion. I do not share it. I didn't deny that his race is keeping people from voting for him. Obviously racist people will vote against him based upon this. I mentioned losing moderate votes that are considering him regardless of his race.
Do you mean to imply that many people would generally disagree with the moral position of their church and still remain in the congregation? Whether you think I should speak for the majority(which I'm not) or giving my opinion(which I am), the above statement seems logical to you?
