President Obama forces GM boss Rick Wagoner to step down

Discussion in 'Free Speech Alley' started by Rex_B, Mar 29, 2009.

  1. Bandit88

    Bandit88 Old Enough to Know Better

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    Sorry about your friend, Okie. It has ever been so. Good people lose jobs, get sick, etc. Not just in this economy, in any economy.

    The question is: do you think it's the government's job to put your friend back in their house or not?

    I don' think the government should be in the business of guaranteeing happiness. Just the opportunity to pursue it.
     
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  2. LSUAthletics

    LSUAthletics Founding Member

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    I understand what progressive taxing is. My point is, even with the progressive tax rates you're proposing, the gap between the middle class and rich will still increase. Maybe not as much but still by a large amount.

    Because investing in stocks is not a necessity for survival as is having a job or owning a business for the middle class person. Since it's not a necessity then there must be a reward potential high enough to overcome the risk factor. The higher the potential reward from investing the more people will invest. By increasing the capital gains tax you are decreasing the reward potential. It's just that simple.


    Tax policy should not be based on who deserves what. It should be based on what's best for the overall economy. Emotional thinking has no place when it comes to writing our tax policies. Logic should tell you that a lower capital gains tax is good economic policy especially during the market environment that is occurring now. That same logic will tell you a healthy stock market is good for everyone including the middle class.
     
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  3. OkieTigerTK

    OkieTigerTK Tornado Alley

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    i think if the govt is gonna bail out the banks then they need to do something to insure that the money goes to helping people that are being f'ed over by those same banks that are sitting on it and not using it to get bad loans and forclosures off the books. if banks would work with families that have a history of doing everything right, then those same families could stay in their homes, keep home prices from falling further, and help stabilize the housing sector. im not saying handouts. im saying work with to restructure loans so people can stay in their homes. and im not saying everyone. if someone bought something that their income wouldnt even cover the mortgage, that was a bad loan in the first place, and part of the greed that got us into this. im saying that those that have excellent credit history and are willing to pay and make things right need to be worked with so they can stay afloat and the banks can keep another forclosure off the books.

    it makes no sense to sit on a bailout and keep forclosing on homes, sending home prices further down, and forcing families out of their homes when they are willing to work to keep their homes.
     
  4. red55

    red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

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    I understand that you think so. But I don't think you've made a case that it has.

    I notice the same about you and most posters, so what. First of all I don't like to repeat myself if I've already made the point previously. Secondly, sometimes you actually make a point that I just let stand without challenge. So maybe you've made a point, what are you crying about?

    That's your response? If I pronounce something as nonsense, I follow it up withthe reason why I think so. Else, people suspect one is just evading the issue.

    Not at all. Neither am I shocked that they rose during a pullout.

    My point is that revenue dropped during the recession and rose during the recovery and I posted a graph to support this. It is you that equated a revenue increase with tax breaks and I offer the same evidence that you did--zero. You're guessing and I'm guessing about that.

    No, you have to establish a relationship between tax cuts and and revenue increases. I posted a chart that tied revenue increases to the economy. I also pointed out that the 2001 tax cuts resulted in a decline which seems to undermine your contention that the 2003 cuts resulted in an increase.
     
  5. gumborue

    gumborue Throwin Ched

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    this is like saying there is no ban on gay marriage because straight men cant marry each other either.

    arent many/most taxes double taxes? sales, cap gains, property
     
  6. SabanFan

    SabanFan The voice of reason

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    The way I look at it is that if one is fortunate enough to have accumulated sufficient wealth to live off the proceeds through a legal and proven method, then good for him or her. The Democrats, however, feel that if someone is getting rich then the system needs to be changed.
     
  7. LSUsupaFan

    LSUsupaFan Founding Member

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    It is in the formula for GDP. What more proof do you need.


    Fair enough. Your statement implies that the W-2 earner carries a larger burden because of the preferred tax rate on the LTCG. That is a non sensical claim. My tax burden is based on my income and its makeup, not my income plus some of the revenue lost because some dude took advantage of the capital gains rate.



    Do you think it is coincidence that several economic recoveries were proceeded by tax cuts?

    Revenue growth plotted against the economy is not a good metric. Revenue will almost always grow during economic expansion.
     
  8. red55

    red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

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    That's fine. It will be an amount directly related to wise investing, not to tax breaks unavailable to a salaried person. I have no problem with people making money, we all try to make money. But making more money shouldn't get one better tax breaks, too.

    How is it not? I know middle-class people who invest for a living, it's not just the super-rich. The issue is with one type of income getting lower rates than other types of income.

    You think people invest just to get that capital gains break? I think they invest to get the much larger profits that the taxes are based on. That's the reward. People with money to invest are going to invest it, they don't need tax break encouragement.

    Sorry, my logic does not tell me this. It tells me that people who work for a living get taxed higher than people who let their money work for their living, which is inherently inequitable.

    That is not in question. The question is disproportionate tax rates.
     
  9. red55

    red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

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    I have no problem with someone accumulating wealth through investment. They just don't need tax breaks on top of it and the country can't afford it. Public money. That's like giving them welfare.
     
  10. DarkHornet

    DarkHornet Louisiana Sports Fan

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    On the surface, I would agree with you. However, you're talking about taxing money they make off of money they ALREADY paid taxes on in most cases (ignoring special savings like IRA's and HSA's).
     
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