Which is more of a crisis in your opinion? The national debt or health care and what do you see this administration doing to fix these major issues? Is it a good idea to try and fix health care by adding billions more to the national debt? We need much bigger numbers. The main tenet of Obama's health care reform is to reduce health care cost. Two thirds of the cost of his plan is to be paid for by health care savings. The main theme of his campaign was to reduce health care cost. However, Douglas Elmendorf, director of the CBO which was appointed by the Democrats has this to say about the health care reform plan: Is the spiraling out of control cost not the main reason why health care is in crisis? Yet we have the head of the CBO, appointed by Democrats, telling us that the health care plan will not only not reduce cost but will increase it. So as of right now if the plan is passed in its present form not only will the health care crisis become even worse the national debt crisis will too.
Very good post, cutting right to the chase. IMO, the health care crisis is the larger problem. The national debt was grossly mismanaged by the repubs the last 8 years, when times were relatively good. We had a recession in 2001, brief and shallow, they had their way and cut taxes in 01 and 03. Unfortunately, it did not work, and the Fed had to cut interest rates to the lowest in 40 years, 1% as late as 04 to get Bush re-elected. This fueled the housing bubble, which along with lack of regulation of mortgage lenders, derivatives and banking, took the financial system to its knees in late 08. Throw in the needless war in Iraq at 1 trillion, and prescription drug coverage in medicare paying only list prices at 650 billion, while reducing tax recreipts, and we doubled the deficit from 2000 to 2008. This was irresponsible. To 2009. We have the worst banking debacle and recession since the great depression. Individuals are losing their jobs and SAVING if they have a job, corporations are cutting expenses, and I agree with much of the stimulus. In times like these, the govt. is the spender of last resort, or the economy can implode. I would quibble with specifics of the stimulus, but of the deficit this year, 700 billion was added last fall by the dem congress and Bush/Paulson/Bernance. That was necessary, buy all responsible accounts I read, such as Warren Buffet and many more. I agree in general with the stimulus. When you are headed for economic implosion, you do what you have to do. As near as I can tell, EVERY GOVT. in the world in similar situation has done the same thing, spend in deficit. There will be a price to pay down the road, lower dollar and inflation. But from the position we were in, THERE WAS NO "GOOD PLAY" IMO. If you know one, please explain. There we bad options and worse options. As far as I know, we took the least bad of the options available. If you fail to spend now, there is now telling how far down the implosion will go, and how many industries will be cratered by the cascade of layoffs. Deflation will reign like in the 30's and the observations I have read is the Fed thinks it can more easily reign in the economy if it overheats, than it can jumpstart a dead economy if they let if fall too far. We can cure inflation with high interest rates as Paul Volker did in the late 70's and early 80's, but it is harder to stop a deflationary spiral down, or so I read. The dems did not create the financial crisis, but they must deal with it. I don't see an obvious better play. Any thing we do will have some negative consequence. I am OK with the path chosen as the least bad. What is worse, the health care crisis or the budget deficit? I would say health care. I tend to look down the road, and if we don't do something big, we will crumble in the long run (our currency). The budget deficit balloon is a short term necessary response to an abnormal business climate (but the correct one IMO). The budget deficit will probably hurt the value of the dollar going forward, reducing our buying power. Nobody will die from it. The crisis in healthcare will also crater the dollar eventually, and people are dying from lack of care, and others are being bankrupted. The only reason it is not a larger outcry is because it is just poor people dying, and for the most part, apparently nobody cares about them very much. Regrettably, this is probably true. I assume this is a "get the camels nose under the tent" strategy. To get this major reform passed, it can't look too bad on the surface. When it is passed and if it starts to break the nation, then rationing limits will be tightened. That would seem to be the way things go in politics. It may be a practical approach. As you said, "if the bill is passed today". Let's see what gets passed. I think something will be passed, but I'm not sure what just yet. Obama says he wants no increase in the deficit. It's a good negotiating statement. I don't think he gets it, but he can get a smaller deficit hit, I believe. Another plan could be to just cut medicare funding and keep our middle class plans and let old folks and poor folks die at significantly faster rates than today by treating them less. Just remember how many of us will rely primarily on medicare when we pass 65... It's rationing, but most of us on this board figure the rationing would hit mostly on someone else, so we're ok with that kind of rationing. Anybody else got a good idea?
how is it not? what? are you ok? do you know what cap and trade is? it is a tax on energy consumption. that is explicitly what it is. do you really need to ask how this hurts the working man? really? why do you ask for explanations about the simplest things? red, the argument is that the environment is more important than the working man. you cant have it both ways. you cant claim anything else. you are again making dishonest arguments, if you say otherwise. before you ask any more nonsense questions, lets be clear on your stance. do you think that the cap and trade bill is anything other than a massive tax? do you understand at all what it is? are you aware that folks consume energy? are you aware that higher energy bills are bad for consumers but ostensibly good for the environment? is your argument that cap and trade not only helps the environment, but consumers as well?
That is not the argument, it is only how YOU choose to frame it. I'm not playing your word games again. Stop telling me what I can and can't do. You only speak for yourself. If you question my honesty again, I will ignore you. You bore me. Go bore somebody else.
ration care. it is immoral (as well as stupid) to pay tens of thousands for care for someone with a year to live and deny care to someone with 50 years to live.
so i repeat: no answer? obama may be a wonderful magic negro, but i am telling you, he isnt gonna help the working man and the environment at the same time with this bill.
If those who are attempting to use fear to convince people that global warming is a man-made imminent threat actually believed what they say, don't you think they would... stop driving cars, stop flying in airplanes, stop purchasing goods that need energy to be made, stop purchasing goods that will eventually end up in dumps, stop watching television, stop using the internet, stop buying newspapers, stop buying or building new homes, start demanding their elected officials cease unnecessary travel, stop using toilet tissue, stop purchasing canned or packaged food, etc., etc., etc. This is just another way to tax the working people of America and attempt to disguise the tax by saying it's in the best interest of the world. BS! When those who are trying to cram this down our throats actually begin to lead by example, I may start to at least listen to them. Until then, it looks like another liberal scam designed to milk tax dollars to use for own interests or payback to certain individuals/groups for their votes. I thought people wanted change. This is nothing more than textbook politics from the party of hypocrites. :nope:
correct. they dont believe it. they are using it as an outlet for their guilt for being human, or just blindly following. if people cared about other people the way they claim they did, they would have entirely different priorities. correct. this is a boondoggle that our leaders are using as a reason to manipulate us. they present us with problems that they can save us from. that way we need them. we want to elect the leader that can save us from the problem they invent. no question. when you run for something i will vote for you.
