Obama is reid and pelosi's bitch. For some reason, he won't stand up to them. I agree with SabanFan that he could be a good president but he's being so weak with his principles and when he comes out forcefully it's only to support reid and pelosi's agenda. He's letting everyone run him over and it's costing him his presidency. He needs to right the ship and quickly.
In a sensible country, people would see Obama as a president trying to define a modern brand of moderate progressivism. In a sensible country, Obama would be able to clearly define this project without fear of offending the people he needs to get legislation passed. But we don’t live in that country. We live in a country in which many people live in information cocoons in which they only talk to members of their own party and read blogs of their own sect. They come away with perceptions fundamentally at odds with reality, fundamentally misunderstanding the man in the Oval Office. Why was this section omitted from the original post? If you want people to be informed and not in a "cocoon", provide the entire paragraph. Otherwise an argument could be made you're attempting to have people "read blogs of their own sect" instead of the entire picture.
i think obama knows reid is in trouble and it is because he (reid) and pelosi moved too far to the left on health care, among other things. obama has to go against those two and sacrifice them if he wants to stay alive. but i do believe he turned things too much over to them. and i dont think reid is shielding. i think there is a true split over things with reid, such as earmarks. i think pelosi is more shrewd and is trying to manipulate every which way she can. but i also believe she is more interested in her own agenda than the presidents. i disagree. obama is standing up to them, but he waited too long. it was more like the error of letting the foxes guard the hen house. the earmarks battle going on with reid that i mentioned being example. he is siding with mccain and the pubs on that issue and trying to force most earmarks out, whereas reid is fighting to keep them to keep the votes. it is a stark difference. wheeling and dealing or straight out on the issue vote.
Earmarks are just part of why people do not like this bill, but it is not what the bill is about. Obama can remain "lofty" by railing against Pelosi and Reid and their methods, but it's the only chance they have to vote a bill stuffed with this much crap. At the end of the day, Obama and congress are not at odds about this bill. It is what he wants - control. He wants a single payer system, and this is the biggest step to it. Most people are smart enough to understand the concept of supply/demand. They also understand the concept that a fixed amount of dollars(healthcare) can't stretch further without reform. They also understand the massive assumptions provided by the White House or even the CBO will not result in any savings. These are some basic economic principles at work here. There is not a single entitlement program or expansion of an existing one that has come in, or under budget. People are not really dumb enough to believe that this will. The reason there are some people for this bill, is because they don't give a **** about losing some of their most basic rights, and they are firmly comfortable with others paying their way. The very idea that the govt can require me to purchase something in order to remain lawful is preposterous. This is the most dangerous precedent set in my lifetime. What is next? The IRS needs those tax returns faster because it is costing the govt too much $ so they pass a bill requiring me to use Turbo Tax? I mean, after all, it would cut down on fraud, speed up the process and save $ for other Americans, right? Don't laugh, this bill sets the precedent. Unbelievable. I don't even touch on the fact that the country has no $, has more debt than ever before, and is in the midst of a deeeeep recession. This would be bad govt if it were still 2005. To do it now, is just one more point of lunacy. Obama is absolutely ok with this. This is a tenet of the left and of HUGE govt. He and the majority of this congress are nearly lockstep with this goal in mind. But I have a feeling that Americans will not sleep walk through this.
i agree it is only a part of it. but i pointed it out as saying i see some real divisions happening within the democratic party. that is just one of them.
Well, I would say you are correct that there are real divisions in the party, but I do not agree that it is between Obama and Pelosi/Reid/Frank/Dodd and their ilk. These guys are putting forth exactly what Obama wants. Obama just has the luxury of sitting back and pointing his finger if they fail him. Cap and Trade passed in the house and has stalled in the Senate. So screw 'em, Obama turned in over to the EPA to regulate. Is that the actions of a moderate?? Realclearpolitics compiles all polls and they overwhelmingly show the American people do not want this bill. Republicans cannot stop it, and have not even slowed it down. Obama's own party is revolting against the bill(hence it isn't passed), but he is out stumping for it even today. 70% of Americans say they want health care reform but want this bill shredded, and for the congress to start over and get it right. But now Pelosi is proposing "deem&pass" in lieu of an actual vote, which as of today she could not win. You really think this woman is not being pushed by Obama??? I just don't see it. Where is the pressure for passage by this weekend coming from if not from Obama? And after watching this guy for a year and seeing his reactions when he gets rejected, I see nothing of the moderate some people claim he would be if Pelosi and Reid were gone.
obama is more liberal than i would like, but i certainly see signs of him pissing off the liberal base of the party by showing a moderate stance on some things. ear marks being just one. troop withdrawal being another. dont ask dont tell, another (all this "study the issue" is dragging it out and not really doing anything which is pissing off the libs). seems there are other fights surfacing with the liberal base, but to be honest, right now i cant remember what they are. i am not talking about just health care. yes he's far left on a lot of things, but on some things is showing a more moderate approach. what i see is someone who isnt immediately giving the libs their way on everything and that is pissing off the far left of the party, and i consider pelosi and reid to be among them. so while most on tf consider him more than a bit liberal, to the liberals in the democratic party, he isnt liberal enough. i am about as moderate as they come and have worked for both democrats and republicans both in a volunteer capacity and as paid staff. obama wasnt who i wanted for president but now that he is the president, when i see any moderate policies i agree with, i will support those, while opposing those i consider too far to the left. health care, too far to the left. i dont support it. but i also think p/r have been a big part of making it that way. that he is opposing ear marks that is something i am at least gonna point out. and if we got lucky enough and it killed the whole damned thing by causing a rift, well, i support it even more! edit to clarify: i dont think obama is a moderate, but i do think on some issues he is showing moderate tendencies. on those i give him credit for not caving to the liberal wing of the dem party. and i am an optimist i guess. where there are tendencies, there is hope for more of a move to the center.
you cant quote too much of an article, so i quote what i think is most interesting. link is provided. gitmo. education (pushed the teachers unions) immigration (hasnt stopped bush policies) war on terror (still uses heavy-handed bush methods) anything to the left of right is far-left. you socialist
why is socialist such a taboo word? You know if my daughter tries to make pancakes and they are disgusting, and she screwed them up big time, does that mean i hate pancakes now, that pancakes can never work? Just because other countries were socialist countries, and they fugged it all up, doesn't mean socialism cannot work if it's done right. Canada, France, England all have socialistic parts of their government, are they nazi's, or are their people oppressed?
Socialism will not work here any more than capitalism would work in Cuba. America was founded and grew based upon free market principles.
