Meanwhile in Florida

Discussion in 'New Roundtable' started by shane0911, Sep 3, 2015.

  1. Winston1

    Winston1 Veteran Member

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    If there was trafficking why did the police take 200+ hours of video before breaking it up?
    Why has the DA now backed off his claim of trafficking?
    Why did they arrest the victims (the women). rather than help them.
    There is too much conflating of sex work and sex trafficking. If you look at the federal statistics and not the wildly inflated stories you’d see the assumption of trafficking is more often a false assumption than not.
    The vast majority of sex workers know what they’re doing and chose their job.
    To assume every sex worker is a victim and is trafficked is inaccurate.
     
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  2. uscvball

    uscvball Founding Member

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    It was a sting operation aimed at catching sex traffickers. If they are going to go to the trouble of setting up video cameras, they are going to get more than a couple hours of evidence and make sure to get plenty of customers on tape.

    The DA never said Kraft was participating in trafficking. His name was initially released by the police for being arrested as part of the sting, therefore the DA also provided his name. The DA has said that parlor was being used for trafficking but that Kraft himself paid women who were NOT trafficked victims. So the DA has not backed off of anything.

    Prostitution is illegal. They broke the law. They will be processed and I'm sure will receive help to determine their status. If they are legal citizens of the US, they'll be processed as such. But see below how they get handled.

    Too much? What is the correct amount and when precisely does it become too much? The thing is, this parlor was doing both and both are illegal in Florida.

    Statistics apparently didn't consider this parlor. However, from the FBI...

    "Human trafficking, believed to be the third-largest criminal activity in the world...FBI human trafficking investigations are conducted by agents within the human trafficking program and members of our federal human trafficking task forces, and every one of our 56 field offices has worked investigations pertaining to human trafficking.
    During the stages of a human trafficking investigation, the primary goal of investigators is the recovery of victims in order to remove them from an environment of violence and exploitation. Program representatives work in unison with victim advocates and NGOs, who are able to provide victims of human trafficking with the short-term resources (shelter, food, clothing) and long-term resources (counseling, education assistance, job training) they require during the road to recovery. After recovering a victim of human trafficking, field offices are then able to conduct logical, efficient, and effective investigations which lead to the eventual arrest and successful prosecution of their traffickers, as well as the potential recovery of additional victims and identification of other traffickers.

    The Bureau’s human trafficking program has also successfully used lawful, sophisticated techniques— such as undercover investigations and Title III wire intercepts—to take down trafficking organizations, recover victims, and intercept traffickers before they are able to victimize others.

    Over the past decade, the FBI’s human trafficking investigations have been responsible for the arrest of more than 2,000 traffickers and the recovery of numerous victims.
    "
    https://www.fbi.gov/investigate/civil-rights/human-trafficking

    From the DoJ, 5 headlines from the last week alone...
    https://www.justice.gov/humantrafficking

    Another perspective....
    The International Labour Organization estimates that there are 40.3 million victims of human trafficking globally.
    • 81% of them are trapped in forced labor.
    • 25% of them are children.
    • 75% are women and girls.
    • There is no official estimate of the total number of human trafficking victims in the U.S. Polaris estimates that the total number of victims nationally reaches into the hundreds of thousands when estimates of both adults and minors and sex trafficking and labor trafficking are aggregated.
    https://polarisproject.org/human-trafficking/facts

    What an igorant comment, really. The "vast majority" of sex workers are women who have been victims of sexual abuse as children, have escaped a domestic situation at home, have children to support, are subjugated by a pimp, and are typically drug addled shells of a human being. "Choosing" to be a hooker on the street isn't a choice but a necessity to live, eat, have shelter.

    Even the highest paid whores to the rich and famous have had pimps, some of them female. Unless a woman is free from duress, stress, poor living conditions, free from drugs and alcohol, and free from any kind of pimp, then it isn't a choice whether they know what the job is or not. Every woman who is a prostitute is somebody's daughter. Something went wrong along the way.

    Brilliant. Who said that?
     
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  3. Winston1

    Winston1 Veteran Member

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    Yes there’s human trafficking as you note yet you ignore the vast majority has nothing to do with sex work. People are trafficked to work n farm labor, factory labor, fishing etc all over the world. Figures cited in article after article about trafficking at events such as the super bowl have been proven to be grossly inflated.

    Follow this event and see how many people, including the proprietors of the massage parlor are charged with trafficking. I’ll bet none are. Trafficking is used to grab headlines.

    You justify taking 200hr of videos as part of the investigation. How can the police allow trafficking to go on for 6 months?. They used these women as badly as the proprietors. They then arrest these women for prostitution which means they can’t get a job anywhere else. How does that help them?

    Yes sex work is illegal.....should it be? Why don’t you research what sex workers say? There is a vast amount published by sex workers who have lived all facets of the life. I can give you references including several who have gone into sex work after graduation from college etc.

    You say there’s coercion if someone (BTW they’re not all women) goes into sex work to eat and have a roof over their heads. Is true of someone who works at Wendy’s or Walmart or anywhere else because they want to eat and have a roof over their heads?

    Much of the effort to rein in prostitution and sex trafficking have the perverse effect of driving more sex workers into the arms of traffickers. Limiting the ability of sex workers to advertise by acts such as SESTA/FOSTA drive sex workers into the dark alleys limit their ability to check on potential clients making life much more dangerous. Again research and listen to what sex workers say. Look at organizations such as SWOP (Sex Workers Outreach Project) and what their experience and position are on the subject. No one is more against sex trafficking than sex workers. It’s a very different world than you imagine.
     
  4. Winston1

    Winston1 Veteran Member

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  5. uscvball

    uscvball Founding Member

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    Lord....amazing what you choose to overlook and what you project. No point in replying to each of your inaccuracies so I'll just stick with more facts.

    Yes, there's a difference between sex workers and sex trafficking. You claim the vast majority of human trafficking is non-sex related. Well...

    "A Global Report on Trafficking in Persons launched today by the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime (UNODC) provides new information on a crime that shames us all.....According to the Report, the most common form of human trafficking (79%) is sexual exploitation. The victims of sexual exploitation are predominantly women and girls. "
    http://www.unodc.org/unodc/en/human-trafficking/global-report-on-trafficking-in-persons.html

    "The 2017 Federal Human Trafficking Report found that of the 661 active sex trafficking cases last year, 65.8 percent involved child victims. And there are potentially hundreds of thousands of victims beyond that number who have not yet been found.

    Some of these children are young teens, lured into capture by older men or women who have befriended them on social media. Some of them are children as young as 3 or 4 who have been kidnapped, or sold into the industry by a relative or guardian."
    https://www.dailysignal.com/2018/12...andemic-in-the-us-and-its-time-to-end-demand/

    "Forced sexual exploitation occurs across the United States. According to the National Human Trafficking Hotline reported call data, 5,591 potential cases of sex trafficking were reported in 2016....The 2017 Federal Human Trafficking Report found that active criminal cases overwhelmingly involved sex trafficking (95.1 percent). ....Forced sexual exploitation in massage parlours highlights the particular vulnerabilities of foreign nationals to modern slavery in the United States. A report released in early 2018 by Polaris estimates that there are more than 9,000 illicit massage businesses in the United States with total annual revenue of US$2.5 billion. Women exploited in massage parlours tend to be recently arrived migrants from China or South Korea. They are typically mothers in their mid-30s to late 50s, who have received no higher than a high school level education, have limited English language skills, and face financial burdens. Similar to domestic work trafficking victims, trafficking victims from massage parlours often work excessive hours and are threatened with arrest or deportation if they try to leave. Threats to tell their families and friends in their home country that they are working in the commercial sex industry are also used to control victims."
    https://www.globalslaveryindex.org/2018/findings/country-studies/united-states/

    But you go right on ahead if you think sex trafficking is overstated. You also seem to believe that trafficking is only a grab for headlines and prosecution doesn't occur but you apparently didn't open the DoJ link I provided. You keep claiming "facts" but so far, I'm the only one that has provided any and they don't support your opinion.


    On to sex workers. There is certainly a hierarchy of jobs within the entire industry where both pay and worker choice are intrinsically linked. The fact is, sex workers on the street have the least choice of all and consequently, make the least amount of money. And yes, most of them are doing it because they were sexually molested as children (researchers note, other studies have proven again and again that most women who work as prostitutes have been physically or sexually abused as children. Farley and Barkan’s findings not only confirm this fact but also highlight that for some, abuse begins so early that the child is not able to comprehend what is happening to her: Fifty-seven percent reported a history of childhood sexual abuse, by an average of 3 perpetrators. Forty-nine percent of those who responded reported that as children, they had been hit or beaten by a caregiver until they had bruises or were injured in some way...Many seemed profoundly uncertain as to just what "abuse" is. When asked why she answered "no" to the question regarding childhood sexual abuse, one woman whose history was known to one of the interviewers said: "Because there was no force, and, besides, I didn't even know what it was then - I didn't know it was sex."https://www.thoughtco.com/prostitution-statistics-rape-physical-abuse-3534139), have no means to support themselves otherwise, and are typically addicts.

    Not only that but they are also regularly victimized as a hazard of the work they do. "Eighty-two percent of these respondents reported having been physically assaulted since entering prostitution. Of those who had been physically assaulted, 55% had been assaulted by customers. Eighty-eight percent had been physically threatened while in prostitution, and 83% had been physically threatened with a weapon....Sixty-eight percent...reported having been raped since entering prostitution. Forty-eight percent had been raped more than five times. Forty-six percent of those who reported rapes stated that they had been raped by customers."

    So workers at this level are likely to have been abused as children, are regularly victimized on the street, and typically become addicts and yet you compare that to taking a job at Walmart?

    There are plenty of studies indicating that prostitution is psychologically harmful. "Not all women in prostitution will suffer from PTSD, but many of us do; even in the most conservative findings, prostitutes are shown to be significantly more likely to suffer from PTSD than the general population."

    "Melissa Farley, PhD, Founding Director of the Prostitution Research and Education, wrote "Bad for the Body, Bad for the Heart" in the Oct. 2004 Violence Against Women, that stated:

    "Laws that justify legalization or decriminalization of prostitution to safeguard women’s health fail to address the psychological harm of prostitution...

    PTSD [Post Traumatic Stress Disorder] is characterized by anxiety, depression, insomnia, irritability, flashbacks, emotional numbing, and hyperalertness. Symptoms are more severe and long lasting when the stressor is of human design. PTSD is normative among prostituted women. Farley et al. (2003) found a PTSD prevalence rate of 68% among those in prostitution in nine countries. This rate was comparable to the rates of PTSD among battered women seeking shelter, rape survivors, and survivors of state-sponsored torture."


    "Hilary L. Surratt, PhD, et. al., in the study titled "The Connections of Mental Health Problems, Violent Life Experiences, and the Social Milieu of the 'Stroll' with the HIV Risk Behaviors of Female Street Sex Workers," in the July 2005 Journal of Psychology & Human Sexuality, wrote that:

    "This study... documented elevated prevalence rates of current depression and anxiety among the sample of street-based female sex workers. These data are supported by similar studies reporting high levels of past year depressive symptoms in 64% to 70% of street sex workers, and well exceed the rates of current depression in both incarcerated women (10%) and women in the general population (5% to 9%). "


    Try googling just three words..."former sex worker" and you'll find plenty of stories of those who have done the job and have left the job. Including this one, "A former sex worker who claims to have slept with “one million men” for £140-an-hour now thinks prostitution should be banned - because it's lonely, dangerous and damaged her health.

    Kat Lee from Manchester began working legally as an escort alongside her twin sister when she was a teenager - after a photographer lured them into the industry. She described herself as an 'outcall' escort, meaning she visits clients, rather than inviting them to her home or hotel room.

    But after a 15-year career, Lee, 32, has decided to leave the industry to become a bartender and charity volunteer, and has issued a warning about how the stigma of her previous profession has damaged her work chances."


    I said it already, if an adult chooses that type of work, are not coerced, forced, drugged, or under the control/payee of another person, then I view it differently although I don't believe they would choose it over a non-sex worker job for the same pay. Children don't grow up with hopes of being a sex worker. No parent would want their child to be a sex worker. People do the work because of the demand, not because of job satisfaction. Would you want your daughter, sister, mother, aunt, wife, girlfriend to be a sex worker? If it's such a great job as you claim, then your answer will be yes.
     
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  6. uscvball

    uscvball Founding Member

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    "Sheriff Snyder said the multi-jurisdiction probe was expected to carry on for the foreseeable future into more and possibly broader human trafficking operations. He said that in many cases it involved coerced women without access to their own transportation, who would be moved from location to location, living where they were taken and sometimes working late into the night.

    ‘Treated Like Cattle’
    Snyder said, for all the attention given to the high-flying men accused, this in his mind is a story of the women: None of the women ever left until they were moved -- and many, he said, had been carried out of their jurisdiction in expensive cars. They had no days off, he said, and cooked rice on hot plates. Condoms were never used, he said.

    “These women are being treated like cattle,” Snyder said. He said of the arrested men: “Any thoughts that they didn’t know they were trafficked women were hogwashed.”
     
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  7. CajunlostinCali

    CajunlostinCali Window Licker

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    I ran out of popcorn, but man, what a lesson. I'll admit, I was somewhat blind to the cause and effect and so it is clearly bigger than I thought it could be. Thanks for the info

    But please, don't let this take away from the fact that Robert Kraft is a 77 year old machine that is killing it on almost every level. He may very well die in some ass, but I believe most of us aspire to such a final demise. I thought I was done twice last week, but made it through.

    Carry on
     
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  8. uscvball

    uscvball Founding Member

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    Including cheating. That's why most hate the Pats. He's a dweeb. Too bad he can't get the ole musket going for his girlfriend.
    [​IMG]

    They've dated for 5 years, were on a break when she had someone else's baby, but are now back together. However, there are a lot of sick folks out there who went after HER on IG after this story broke....

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2019
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  9. CajunlostinCali

    CajunlostinCali Window Licker

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    When I said he was a 77 year old machine, I meant all-encompassing, like business, superbowls, douchebaggery. I am not here to argue his moral ineptitudes, just pointing out that he does more than most his age without much care in the world. I don't aspire to be the dude, just able to perform, at all, at the age of 77.

    Vent away
     
  10. uscvball

    uscvball Founding Member

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    I get you, I don't disagree, I just added one item to the list, lol.
     

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