Is There a ‘Right’ to Health Care?

So, you're saying I should pay more taxes and have worse healthcare benefits while you get something for free that I'm willing to pay for through my employer? Is that what you're saying? We seem to both agree that we are unfairly taxed...why then would you agree to pay even more in taxes? And trust me, we WILL pay more in taxes. Free healthcare? If there is one constant truth in life my friend, it's that nothing in life worth having is free. Me, and the overwhelming majority of Americans, will once again be forced to sacrifice in order for the overwhelming minority to benefit. You seem to be an intelligent person, surely you do not agree with socialism.

 

You used them as an example to put us (America) down. What other conclusion was I to draw?

I know perfectly well what I am talking about. I also know enough not to trust a government source when it's the government trying to shove this crap down our throats.

I wouldn't call your source unbiased. They (the government) have everything to gain while I have everything to lose. It's that simple.

I didn't say they were all bad people. I didn't say they weren't down on their luck. I simply said that they were not my problem. Your number "46-49 million" has been shot down numerous times. It's a lie. The people using this number know that it's a lie. The media sources that report this number know that it's a lie.

Unfortunately, some people seem to be too stupid to gather the facts on their own. When you remove the temporarily unemployed (people simply between jobs), the younger people who choose not carry health insurance, the extremely wealthy that don't need it, and the 12 million or so illegal immigrants, you are left with about 10 million people who honestly desire health insurance that do not have it. 10 million out of well over 300 million. Not 1/6.

Again, citing a government source defending socialized healthcare is no more creditable than an OSU Buckeye fan defending the Big 10.

If left up to me, she never would have gained entrance to the hospital to begin with. If she has family, then they should take care of her. If she belonged to a church, they could help her. Hell, she was at a free clinic to begin with. They did their part...she left there in stable condition and is probably alive and well tonight. Either way, she's one person. They may have a few other similar cases...big freaking deal. A handful of examples does not show a trend. As I type this reply, millions of people are held up in hospitals all across the country that aren't paying a dime for the services they are receiving. The "government" doesn't want you thinking about that though. They want you believing that people are dying in the streets by the hundreds of thousands. They want you believe that tens of millions are suffering without any healthcare what-so-ever. Obviously you are gullible enough to buy the crap they're selling.

 

Regarding public education, some facts:

Education in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So, we're middle of the pack in science, above grade in reading, and a little below grade in math. That could certainly be better.

My observation is that results vary greatly in public education, and more middle income districts produce better results and poorer areas product poorer results. A lot has to do with the parents, how much they value education, and how much of their income they are willing to give the school district to buy the resources necessary to do a better job. In the suburbs here in Houston, the public schools are very good. The inner city schools are not so good. Out in the burbs, we pay for subsidies and pay our teachers more, so we get real good teachers. Money talks.

There is nothing intrinsically wrong with public schools. I went to them, my kids all went to them, and they worked fine. Kids that wanted a good education got one. Kids that didn't care about their education didn't get a good one. But it wasn't the schools fault.

 

I did not say it was the school's or teacher's fault. I agree that the parents are largely to blame for the sorry product that is so often produced in our schools. My point is that it is a shame that the most developed country on the planet is only "middle of the pack" when it comes to education. The governments role in education is one of the large factors in it's inadequacy.

Name for me one single government ran program that is successful. With the pitiful example the government has set over the last 75 years when trying to act on the public's behalf, why should I trust them with anything, least of all mine and my family's healthcare?

 

What bugs me is that doctors charge a ridiculous amount for general procedures, and I bet a large amount of that is coming from my taxes, though perhaps indirectly. Most of us don't shop around for the best healthcare deal, and there aren't that many choices for most of us. As it stands now, our healthcare system is a joke and doctors are riding that pony to the bank.

 

I did not put us down, other than to point to the pathetic lack of efficiency in our system, where we spend nearly twice as much of our GDP and fail to cover everyone.

That data was from 07, its data from Bush's admin. Do some searches, that's pretty much the number I see come up. But again, you cite NO source at all, why should anyone believe you? I sure don't.

Again, you cite no source. This has no credibility without a source.

You also said this:

I have shown that many times you are wrong about poor folks getting acute care, and hospitals all over the country are dumping poor folks in urban skid rows without adequate treatment. That's why the hospital was charged with criminal offenses.

This is democracy. You may not want to pay into this system, and a lot of folks didn't want the war in Iraq and we got it anyway. We will both end up paying for things we want, and for some things we don't want.

The problems in our current health care system as bad enough that people decided to elect a new set of politicians to fix it. I think this was a if not the, biggest issue in the election.

Too many people can't get insurance if they have a pre-existing condition, what are they supposed to do then, just die?

Too many peope that have been healthy and get sick and have a private policy are "dropped" from their insurance coverage when they really need it. That's not right.

The cost of heathcare is rising 3 times faster than inflation and has been for years. It is a horrible burden on business and makes us less competitive on the world markets, when other industrialized nations can cover everyone for 10% of GDP and we spend 17.

High healthcare was a big contributor to the failure at GM. There were a lot of other reasons, but $1,200 of every GM car sold was going to healthcare, while Toyota spend $200. Japan has national healthcare.

If we don't check the inflation in healthcare costs, it will swamp the nation causing a devaluation of the dollar over time, and eating away our standard of living. We can pay now, or we can pay later, but there is no pain free way out of this one. We can get a healthcare system we can afford, or devalue the currency over time.

We cannot sit here and do nothing and think things will stay the way they are today.

 

That "joke" is still the best damn healthcare system on the planet. Is it perfect? No. But it's still the best.

 

The fed. govt. is good at solving large problems that the states could not do on their own.

We have the best military in the world, federally funded. It is not the most efficient, but it is the best.

Look at the interstate highway system. It is a tremendous boon to national commerce. It would not exist if left to the states.

Man on the moon in a decade, with the best computer at the time being far less powerful than your average PC today. NASA run.

Food inspection. Our food supply is very good. The FDA claims they are very understaffed (which is probably true), yet food purity is generally not an issue. There's a salmonella outbreak every now and then, but for the most part nobody worries about the food we buy.

 

You feel ok with doctors taking as much money as they can? HMOs pay a lot for their services, and I'd guess HMOs get some of their money from the gubment. I wonder if I'm just way off on that.