even if the best case scenario happened and the woman was quietly apprehended, that is still terrible, as she was just involved with drugs, no big deal. those cops should be doing something else instead going around shooting at people for no reason.
The Drug War is not a war at all, it is a Persecution. The Nuremberg Precedent should be applied to those who perpetuate the Persecution. "Speak Truth to Power." tgsam [email protected]
I love to watch people discuss excessive and deadly force. In the world of law enforcement, there is no such thing as excessive force, only necessary force. Its the force required to put a stop to the situation. In some instances, the result of the use of necessary force is deadly. However, sometimes the use of deadly force is necessary to save lives. Would discharging a firearm either at a person in a moving vehicle or in an attempt to shoot out the tires of said vehicle not both be considered use of deadly force? Had the officers not fired and a pursuit ensued and a patrol unit PIT'd the preachers car and he died as a result of a crash, would the PIT maneuver be considered deadly force, or would it have been necessary force required to halt the pursuit? Just some food for though.
excessive is above what is necessary. in some situations deadly is not excessive. shooting at tires is not deadly, unless by "deadly" you are talking about the tires or if someone is standing in front of the tires. shooting at the driver is probably excessive if the car is going 2 mph. id say there has to be a reasonable expectation that the car would cause significant injury before the driver is shot at.
You should give a little latitude when you jump out of an unmarked van looking like a gang of drug dealers waving guns around.
I'm honestly surprised by your response. I would have thought that you would have said that the simple act of discharging of a firearm in a suspect/perp's direction would be considered use of deadly force, regardless of the intended target (tires, vehicle or driver). So by that logic, shooting out the tires to stop the vehicle would be necessary force. However, shooting at the car of the fleeing suspect would be considered deadly force if the bullet actually hit the driver. Is that your position, that its only deadly force if someone if physically shot? If not, can you restate your position. This topic really interests me, and I am enjoying this thread. What if they intended to shoot the tires out and accidentally shot the driver? Is that necessary or excessive? Would that be considered the use of deadly force in that instance? Excessive force is always subjective when used in the context of more than necessary force. Law enforcement will always say that they used necessary force. Critics will almost always say that the amount of force used was excessive. I would presume that only Internal Affairs and/or Judge and Jury can reasonably determine if law enforcement used a level of force that was more than necessary. I suspect most of the general public would disagree with that statement.
I'm more interested in the general discussion on the difference between necessary and excessive force. Its very unfortunate that the entire situation went down the way it did and a man of the cloth lost his life. I suspect the police who were involved will learn a lifelong lesson from this unfortunate incident.
Jimmy Swaggart comes to mind. I don't know the facts in the Georgia incident but 2 or 3 years ago there was a guy in Baton Rouge who was selling pot out of his house. He had a quantity of pot in his house and a large sum of money. From what I have been told from a friend of the pot dealer (a customer?) the police kick his door in without identifying themselves as the law. Fearing that he was being ripped off, the dealer shot and killed the first cop that came through his door. After that, of course he was immediately gunned down by the rest of the cops raiding his house. If what I have been told is true two deaths could have been avoided if the police had identified themselves before breaking down the door. The pot dealer was a person with no police record and no history of violent acts.
