Evangel & John Curtis

Just read that the LHSA or whatever it is called is now looking at creating a super 6A class for football only that teams could decide to play up in and IMO that may be the best solution if they get enough teams that want to do it. But I have my doubts because of the statewide travel, but since it would be for football only it may work.

 

They voted against the split and this compromise a few months ago...They aren't going to tweak it anytime soon, if you ask me...The overall goal is to shut down football factories from recruiting...Basically, to crush Evangel, but with JDB's exit from the ranks of the ECA faithful, it's almost a foregone conclusion...

I applaud the LHSAA's effort, but judging from the recent hiring process of the EBRP School Board for a EBRPSB Director position, you can't trust the hiring methods of local school boards, so how can you trust the principals they hrie?

The solution is to form a private school league. New Orleans has the Catholic League...They get the picture...Why can't everyone else in the state do likewise and instead of aligning along the joined bond of Catholicism, unite in the name of recruiting and offering scholarships to 13 year old junior high kids?

 

I think a private school division might be a good idea as long as they can still play and compete against the public schools but I'm still opposed to seperating them entirely. Having said that, a seperation would be much better than the present system of forcing 1A and 2A schools to play the Evangels and John Curtis' because the bigger public schools would rather avoid them than improve their own programs and compete.

 

You're missing the entire point here...They're not avoiding them out of a fear of competition...They can't compete in the same manner that they do...They cannot recruit, so they are at a competitive disadvantage...

The solution in their minds is to make it less appealing to go to a school like JC or Evangel...If you cannot compete against the elite, then you won't shine in the same manner that kids like Berlin and Hester did in the past...

Playing 1A and 2A teams won't appeal to kids like playing Jehovah Jireh and Kaplan and other small schools...It will cripple the football factories that are seemingly created for no other reason than to make good high school football teams...

I mean, how many state titles did JC or Evangel win in sports OTHER than football?

They can't compete because they can't play by the same rules as a private school...It's that simple...There is no fear, only a want for equal competition...and this IS the solution...

 

For years, Texas private schools had their own league. Recruiting was aparently not a big issue. Students in the large school districts like Dallas (that are bad districts) would choose private schools (of which there are still far fewer than in cities in Louisiana) for a chance to go to Harvard or Yale. Most athletes, however, just lived in the suburbs like Plano, and had a great public school education (our SAT scores are the highest for any school district our size in the nation--Plano is a city of approx. 250,000).

That being said, Texas, just this year, has started allowing willing private schools to join the UIL (Texas' version of the LHSAA).

Once again, Louisiana, in trying to copy other states, is a "day late and a dollar short" in accomplishing that goal.

 

I don't think I'm missing the point at all. I keep hearing about this supposed solution, though I've never seen a printed quote from LHSAA official actually stating such, but what do you think the 1A and 2A division schools think of this "solution". How is it fair to these usually rural teams who may have trouble even fielding a team to have to compete against Evangel and John Curtis? That was a real courageous decision by the higher, larger classifications.

And why can't public schools compete with Evangel? Hahnsville beat them last year and West Monroe might have beaten them this year had they gone for OT. Evangel plays public schools from out-of-state and gets beat. Why can't Louisiana public schools compete as well?

Before Evangel came to 5A, W. Monroe dominated the state. Why couldn't the other public schools compete with W. Monroe? Does W. Monroe recruit?

Other MLB teams can't compete with Steinbrenner's deep pockets and most of the smaller market teams are at a competitive disadvantage. Would it be a good thing for MLB to demote the Yankees to the minor leagues under the assumption that players wouldn't want to play for the Yankees in the minors therefore making a level playing field for the rest of baseball? Would the NBA have been better off without MJ and the dynasty of the Bulls?

But on the topic of making the private schools less appealing, remember that Evangel did not become a force only after ascending to 5A. Evangel surpassed the 5A teams while still in 1A and 3A. Evangel will continue to play top out-of-state schools in high profile games every year. Kids will continue to go to Evangel for the exposure to Div I programs. Evangel will continue to win state championships. So I think this is a dubious and even fallacious argument. The upper classifications simply do not want to play Evangel and John Curtis, period. The winner is undoubtedly W. Monroe. The losers, unfortunately, are the poor lower class schools that have been betrayed by the principals of the larger schools.

Seperating private and public schools, while still undesirable in my opinion, would have been a better solution than squashing the lower division programs.

 

If you have such hard proof that John Curtis is recruiting, then do Tommy Henry and the LHSAA a favor and release this information. In the past decade the TP has done no less than 3 full evaluations of John Curtis and has found nothing illegal (there is no telling how many have been done since the early 70's when we started winning state titles). However, the LHSAA has had to act in recent years and punish some public schools that were breaking the rules. Any child in the state can go to any school of his/her choice with the proper paper work, even Brady James transfered between two public high schools while he played football in the LHSAA. I don't buy the arguement . . . because these schools are so successful they must be doing something wrong or illegal. John Curtis has an open door policy, if you feel something wrong is going on there, feel free to check them out. You would think that someone would have found something since these 19 state football titles have been won over a span of 30 years.

I understand why the LHSAA decided to have the vote, but changing classification is not going to solve the problem. If this is about lowering the popularity of these schools, I can tell you John Curtis was nationally ranked in the 80's when they were in 2A, which also happens to be the decade we won our "mythical" national title and sent the most players to Div1A schools. Three Louisiana high schools have won these mythical national title. . . John Curtis, Evangel, and West Monroe. Currently John Curtis is ranked 9th in the nation for 2004, and has the highest winning percentage of any high school in the country that has played at least 300 games (3 schools in Louisiana made the top 25). It may hurt Evangel, I'm not sure because I don't know the school situation in Shrevport. Next season you will have three '04 State Title winners in 1A and two '04 State Title winners in 2A. Sounds like 1A and 2A will do just fine as far as respect and popularity.

College recruiters do not just visit 5A schools because they are the biggest. College recruiters are attracted to schools with good coaching and places where they have established relationships. If you are good enough the scouts will find you. Either way this doesn't matter, because as good as John Curtis is in football they don't produce an unusual amount of Div1A talent. So if you are looking for an easy way to college through football as a parent for your child, you will always have better options than choosing John Curtis. Why choose a school where your only chance to start may be your Sr year, when you can go somewhere else and can be the star for 4 years? If you really want to showcase your talent, why choose a school that only passes the ball 2 to 3 times a game? This is probably why John Curtis doesn't have a lot of transfers or all state players.

You keep making it seem as if these schools asked to play up to garner respect or attention. Maybe in Evengel's case they did ask, but I know John Curtis never asked to play up. John Curtis came very close to joining the Catholic League in the 90's, but the 5A New Orleans Catholic league girl schools did not want to compete with Curtis. So we had a choice, drop girl sports or stay in 4A. Once in 4A they put us in a public school district made up of schools located in the New Orleans projects. It turned out worse than the LHSAA thought, those schools' football programs improved dramatically (handing us our first district loss and shut out since 1977). When the New Orleans schools had enough of that, they moved us to a district where our games were 1 to 2 hours away. The point back then was that if Curtis doesn't play in a true New Orleans district, then kids will not want to play there. My point is that John Curtis has always played where they were asked to play, through all the classification and district changes through the decades . . . John Curtis has continued to win State Titles.

I don't expect anyone to know as much about my own school as I do, but John Curtis does a lot for New Orleans and other area high schools. During the summer the JC coaching staff hosts football camps for other local high schools kids and coaches (from both the high school and college level). In the past Holy Cross, Rummel, Ecole, St Martin's, OPWalker, and other various schools in the area have joined Curtis in hosting these summer camps. Academically John Curtis ranks right in the middle of the Catholic and private schools in the New Orleans area. We do not have an academic program like Jesuit, but we are not a sports factory either. Over 95% of John Curtis graduates enter college.

As far as sport state titles, other than football, here is John Curtis' list:

Volleyball: 3 State Championships; 2 State Runners-Up;14 State Tournament Appearances

Baseball:6 State Championships; 4 State Runners-Up

Softball: 1 State Championships

Track and Field: State Champion 110m hurdles; State Champion 200m, etc

John Curtis offers these sports . . . Football, Volleyball, Boys and Girls Basketball, Baseball, Softball, Track and Field, Wrestling, Golf, Swimming, and Tennis.

Sorry I keep making these post long, but I'm trying to address all the topics of this issue in just one post. :thumb:

 

I'll back my fellow Curtis alum here, but go a step further. Your assertion is that "they" can't compete, because of Curtis' competitive advantage.

Are there some inherent advantages to being private? Of course. Are there some guys at Curtis mainly to play football? Probably. But you want to talk about the public schools being UNABLE to compete? I submit that the more proper word is UNWILLING. And anyone who wants to can go see for themselves.

Head on out to a Curtis practice sometime. Come on out after Daylight Savings ends and it gets dark at 5:15. The freshmen pull their cars around the field and turn their lights on so practice can keep going - the surrounding neighborhood won't let Curtis put lights around its practice field. They'll still be out there after 6, when the kids playing for those schools that want "equal" competition are talking on their cell phones to their girlfriends, or playing XboX. And those Curtis players at the into-the-night practice will have lifted weights for an hour already that day. They'll have spent their lunch hour watching film of their upcoming opponent in a room above the girls' gym, too.

(You may want to stick your head in again at Thanksgiving. No big meal for JT's boys - practice that afternoon. Those who fire down too much stuffing get exposed quick.)

Come back in March/April, during spring conditioning. The football players that also play baseball lift during their normal PE time, do their spring drills immediately after school lets out (it is not uncommon for one of those drills to involve rolling UP the Miss. River levee just south of Jefferson Highway. Try it sometime.), THEN go to baseball practice for 2+ hours. They'll do it again the next day for as long as the LHSAA allows spring drills to go on.

And come out one more time in July. The Patriots will be lifting, getting ready for the next season on their own, with only the strength coach around, while the starting QB at Equal Competition High is twirling his whistle on a lifeguard stand somewhere.

If the 4A and 5A schools want to get rid of Curtis at a meeting, rather than outworking them on the football field, that's their right. Roberts Rules of Order at work. But call a spade a spade - those schools choosing to run rather than compete. Every day the coach at Equal Competition High blows a whistle to start practice, he has an equal opportunity to compete. The kids on the team do, too. But they throw it in the trash every time they eat a Big Mac, or shut down practice at 5:20, or make weightlifting optional.

Long/short, I'd be a lot more sympathetic to the plight of the public-schooler if I thought for a second any of them dedicated themselves half as much.

 

That's all you had to say...There is an inherent advantage from being a private school. Period. Point blank. There is no "We work harder" or, "We've done all we've been asked."

They're unable to compete because they cannot do what JC does...If Denham Springs High School tells a kid, "Come play football for DSHS and the Yellow Jackets because you live in Denham," then that is not fair compared to what Evangel says when they pitch to prospective kids, "Come play football for us no matter where you live and we'll pay for your tuition, play a national schedule, and ensure you get lots of media exposure."

That is not f-a-i-r...Your other alumni talked about professional sports and the Yankees...High School Sports aren't professional, and the "deep pockets" argument is ridiculous. You're going to say that Evangel and JC are just like the Yankees and you can't blame them is ridiculous...

It's like saying that the MLS should compete in a system like the one they exist in now, where the league centrally controls and basically owns each franchise, as well as player personnel decisions and acquisitions-both coming & going-for the league, but have one or two franchises that can make their own moves, have an unlimited spending conditions, and can bring in whomever they like, free from the constraints of the other teams out there...

It'd be like you trying to defend the fairness of those two autonomous franchises competing against the rest of a constrained league...It's impossible to defend, as is both your stances...If you offer a scholarship to a kid to play football, you should compete against other schools that do, and only those schools. Schools that cannot r-e-c-r-u-i-t their players as opposed to just drawing for their population and attendance zones aren't able to compete in the same manner.

Thanks for agreeing with me, but try not to weakly glance over the main crux of this situation next time.

 

I know from a co-worker about J.C.'s work ethic. Kids practice/work-out "on their own" without supervision because if they don't you damn well better believe they won't be on the field come fall. You can deny it if you want but it is what he went through with his son. Christmas dinner? Naught...he was in the weightroom working out. Could he have stayed home and eaten that dinner? Sure...but then he would have been setting up water cups and 10K during games instead of dressing out. I know...I "heard" from a friend but it doesn't make it untrue.

I guess the underlying question is did the LSHAA suspect "legal" recruiting and made this decision to punish "Private High School"? I'll go back to 1979 when I was in the 8th grade. I was playing basketball on a Junior High team and we had this guy who was pretty good (eventually attended and played at that large University in Baton Rouge). Forward to High School. He was now attending "Private High School" who is a notorious super power in basketball. Maybe he got in for being a good student? I had classes with the guy. Let's just say readin' writin' and 'rithmatic weren't his strong suits. Now to my Junior year. His younger brother is in my High School. He isn't an athlete (not that I was much of one either) but his family can only afford to send one son to "Private High School"? Hmmm...