What's your point? As the strongest and most dominant country in the world, why the hell should we ask permission to take a piss? Just because we aren't the only inhabitants of the planet Earth doesn't mean we can't do things on our own accord. How do you think we got to where we are today? The U.S. is a teenager compared to other nations of the world and yet it only took us roughly 150 years to become a dominant super power. We wouldn't be where we are today if we'd spent the infancy of our country being Britain and France's bitch. We certainly aren't going to get anywhere now by being the UN's bitch. I still say screw the UN.
Ok? While you want to criticize a lot of people around here, I haven't seen any suggestions of what you would do differently. Why don't you share your views? If it is the fact that we will never kill them all, heal a cut? How do you become friends or fix people who would rather blow you up or chop your head off without thinking twice? I now think we should shut down the electrical grids in Pakistan, Syria and Iran but I see nothing wrong with giving them an ultimatum to turn over their terrorists and clean up their acts. It is then up to them and not us who should die, there is no doubt in my mind that we are right because of the innocent people who have died at the hands of terrorism through the years. If you are trying to say they are right and we are wrong then state your case. Where have you been the last 12 years? We did nothing after the 1993 WTC attack but bring a few of them through our justice system and it did zero good. The point is that we have been attacked by the bad guys off and on since 1993 and we did very little if anything meaning that we were "good" and gave the terrorists very little to be "mad" at us and :911: still happened. Your 1st point:Al Quada declared war and attacked us numerous times, do you object to the fact that innocent people do die in war? With your point I take it you are 100% against war at all cost. I don't consider those that aid terrorists innocent people. How many thousands of civilians would you be willing to let them kill in Britian, America, Spain and other western countries before you could accept casualties in their countries. Is it ok if they kill us but we don't want to kill their innocent people? Has anything like this ever been solved peacefully? Look at the Palestinian/Isreali situation, that is a long term example. 2nd point, I don't know, never said that! 3rd point, While terror cells are around the world most of them lead in and out of Pakistan/Afghanistan region or the middle east. It won't do you any good to nab a few terrorists here and there if you don't shut down their training camps and schools which are mainly listed in the Pakistan region and a few other countries that support terrorism. You say killing lots of terrorists is good? Well you would have to take out their schools, religious schools and training camps for starters? Geaux back to the Democratic playbook and try again for Bush and Veep part. People like you scare me, you would try and be friends or find peace with someone thats sworn to kill you, before you know it your head would be gone. These people would also blow you up, a speeding car would approach you and you wouldn't have time to raise your white flag because it would blow you up! You can't make deals, appease these people because they won't give you the time of day, they would give you zero time for bargaining! Imagine if we had this attitude with Japan in WWII after they attacked Pearl Harbor or in Europe, We might all be speaking German or Japanese today! :hihi:
Well unlike some posters I don't post to see myself type. If someone else has the same point of view as me I don't see the need to post mine. I only post when I can add to the discussion without repeatin myself or someone else. My point is that it is impossible to win a war of attrition. The Barbaric wars of ancient Rome, The Texas Revoloution, and Vietnam are examples. We won't win the global war on terror without changing the way people think. To clarify I am not talking about people who are already jihadist. I am talking about your average Muslim. I do not think we should pow wow with the enemy. Terrorist must be dealt with, but if innocent Muslims get caught in the crossfire we make more enemies. If we cut off power, food, or water to these people we are not going to scare them away from becoming terrorists we are going to drive them straight into the terror training camps. Just because someone lives in a country where the govenrment supports terrorist does not mean they support it. I don't know how you figure I am against war at all costs. And no it is not okay for them to kill us. It is equally not okay for us to kill their innocents. Large terror cells operate in Somalia, the Phillipines, Indonesia, and South America. We have not move against them yet. That is a problem The Democrat playbook line is weak. The only democrat I have ever voted for was Hunt Downer, chairman of Louisiana Democrats for Bush. No the difference is I am not an extremist. You don't care how many innocent Muslims die as long as we win. Well that sounds alot to me like the way a jihadist thinks. They don't care how many of us die. You can't compare the war on terror to the WWII. In WWII we knew the enemy, we knew what they wear, and we knew why they wanted us to die. That is not the case in this war. We don't know why they hate us except that they do. It would be wise to start fighting that disease and changing hearts and minds and stop fighting the symptoms.
Do you or do you not support the war in Iraq? If not, why not? We aren't changing the hearts and minds in Iraq by getting rid of Saddam and building schools etc, how about Afghanistan? 1) I like to type? 2)Germany? Did we win with the occupation of Germany? They had insurgents there, they weren't all in uniform, attacking our troops. How do we change the way the average Muslims think when they are taught to hate us and distrust us? We can't even change the way our spouses think or the way they are! The more terrorists the better, easier to identify and kill! 3)Like I said before, I think it is better to kill off the root of the problem, Where terrorists are born and trained is Pakistan, Iran, Syria. Your large terror cells I call small, you get rid of them and more will come from the above countries. I'm not an extremist, I wish they would've lived in peace and left us alone and 9/11 and other attacks had never happened. I prefer to live in peace with my family. Lets quit talking into general terms and be more specific shall we? I would give these countries an ultimatum, Like I said above. It is their choice not mine, terrorists came from their country not mine. I would cut out the electrical grid and after a certain amount of time with no cooperation I would make sure the grid is still out and drop pamplets to evacuate all cities and level them, just like your favorite parking lot. I would use conventional weapons only. Alot of this depends on the responses of the other side, if we have problems and bombings in this country and others while a conflict is going on. If we get strung out or in a bind I would become less friendly, flatten all the cities in all these countries if I have too. I would try and save the "innocent" people of these societys but the problem is that these societys teach hate and death to the western world to all their people. This is one reason why they hate us so. WWII had insurgents and Kamikazes just like this war, some were in uniform and some wasn't. The war in Japan was also more winnable than the war on terror for reasons you stated, we knew who the enemy was. In my opinion, one reason Truman chose the route he did was because of the kamikazes. I think if any war would ever justify the Japan like scenario it is this war on terror where no one knows all the individuals involved, there kamikazes are more dangerous than those of Japan. I'm against this scenario unless its a last resort. It is the president of the USA's job to protect and defend the people of this country and the constitution and not the Mohammads of the world. I don't think like them because I don't go around training people to kill innocent people nor wanting people to die. This world has a serious crisis and we can't afford to lose it at any cost. We no longer have the Trumans, Mac Arthurs or Pattons of the world, we are too weak kneed and it shows. If Muslims are so innocent then why are they and their leaders so silent everytime an attack happens? OK, your turn, lets get specific, what do you mean by not moving against?
Sourdough, You just gave us another example of the dichotomy Supafan spoke of. In the same post you defend the occupation of Iraq by insisting we are changing the hearts and minds there and the importance of bringing these poor muslims freedom by removing Saddam. Then you turn around and advocate the leveling of entire islamic countries because the terrorists we seek are also muslim. By the Bush Eliminate the Dictator and Bring Freedom doctrine you should be advocating that we occupy these countries and build schools. You're not making any sense at all.
:dis: I wasn't talking about Iraq!! If you would've read the post above that, I was clearly talking about Syria, Iran and Pakistan not somewhere we are already! Where did I ever mention Iraq or a place that we are already there. Red, Where have you or Supafan or Chaos ever came up with any ideas on how to fix these problems? All you do is attack your favorite posters to go after, Just like you did in my hurricane Betsy post, I was alive then, you should've done your research before correcting me! One more thing, not making any sense? I never said my doctrine would be the same as W? :dis: But I support what he's doing because he is president! I'm in a pissy mood because I'm tired of the supposedly middle of the road people and the do gooders on this board who attack other people and never have solutions for any problems. You can now delete your thread about Karl Rove, Jack Wilson is a Klintonite and a John Kerry supporter, a leftist in this country who supports the theory on the left! End of story! http://www.washtimes.com/national/20040214-120835-4661r.htm In the first quote you quoted I NEVER said whether I supported it or not Amigo, it was a question? Anything to make me look bad from you and Chaos? :cuss: You people will have to find someone new to pick on! :nope: Bye
Sougherdough no one is picking on you. Someone with an opionion divergent to yours does not mean they hate you or are picking on you. Just because I think the war in Iraq is an ineffiecient use of resoureces doesn't mean I hate you or that I'm trying to make you look stupid.
Supafan, I wasn't really talking about you my friend. The only thing I meant by your name is that you haven't given any solutions here that I have seen other than questioning others which is fine i guess? The bottomline for me is all this little talk and arguing over Iraq is stupid, We are there like it or not! It is also very stupid to argue over any Republican or Democrat or any politician in Washington DC. As long as the status quo stays, neither party is going to do the right thing for America, no one is going to tackle the borders issue. Both sides will also continue to steal tax money for pork projects and scandals, house banking scandal etc. WE NEED A REVOLUTION in this country because no one is really looking out for our best interest! :dis:
First of all. I'm not Supafan or Chaos, are you getting us confused? And I have posted my ideas on how to "fix" things many times Sourdough, are you serious? You criticised most of them. I did it again this morning for LSUcraig. Name an issue and I'll find you my comments on it. You are off base on this accusation and I can prove it, if neccessary. Really? That's all I do, huh? This is a forum for discussion Sourdough! You post inflammatory comments here all of the time and people do respond to them. If this upsets you, perhaps you are in the wrong forum. You are the only one making personal attacks here, my friend. I only attack your ideas. You were being teased on the Hurricane Betsy post, Sourdough and you know it. You saw the :wink: and you knew it was just a joke and responded in kind at the time. So today you say I attacked you! Did something happen to your sense of humor? I admit my error, Sourdough, you did go though Hurricane Betsy at one month old. Please share your experiences with us. :wink: It's a joke, amigo, Lighten up. People attack your comments Sourdough, not you personally. What else do you post them for? This is a discussion board! People have posted their ideas and solutions, here. A quick search will find them. You are confused and mistaken. Wilson didn't break any laws. Someone in the White House leaked the Plame story (probably Rove) and that is a possible major crime and it is news. You can't make it go away. The thread won't be deleted. We'll just let this one play out. Rove may get off scott free, since the prosecuter is from the Bush-appointed justice department. But the damage is done. 60-75% of the American people think Bush is not being honest about the matter( pick your poll). That's a lot of republicans, too, not just Red, Chaos, and Supafan. It's not about you! You are being too damn sensitive. If somebody points out the holes in your arguments, you take it as a personal attack and then you take your dolly's and go home. Mayby FSA ain't your particular forum, mon ami. But, I think you are just having a bad hair day. :wink: That was a joke, too. You know, friendly banter. :hihi:
