Anyone still believe in the merit of Affirmative Action?

You want to discuss and find solutions.
Let's start with this statistic, I believe to be much, much more accurate than other statistics you've provided.
40% decline in black population at CalBerkley when race is not considered?
Why is that? Is it because the Cal admissions board is racist? Far from it.
It is because the standardized testing favors white kids? The distinctive Asian flavor of the Berkley campus belies that argument.
So we come, using one of your specific examples of what is described as a large-scale problem, to an issue of blacks inability to compete with other races using standard academic measurements.
What are possible solutions to that?
Drop the standards to a point they are meaningless? For example, you must score a 13 on the ACT to get into Berkley, and whether you score a 13, 23 or 33, you get the same points?
Just drop the standards all together and go to a lottery system? Everyone applies that wants to get in, their name is put on a card and the first x number of names drawn gets in?
I believe if you believe as you claim that you want to fix societies racial issues, you need to address each any every situation individually. Not just claim a grand symptom and clamor for a grand cure that arguably you, or others, well know will NEVER be fixed.

 

Perhaps this is a Southern phenomenon, but I've seen that in many of the majority black schools, the majority of the teachers (to say nothing of the *administrators*) tend to be black.
Could it be that these black teachers got into universities and were promoted towards a degree under the flag of A-A?
Could their be a correlation between the performance of black kids in *black schools* and the fact their teachers were A-A kids?
And what do you mean by *environment*. These black kids are surrounded, obviously, by other black kids in *black schools*, is that poor environment in your opinion for a kid to be in?

 

When I say environment, I mean these inner city schools are usually located in places where there is lots of violence and drugs. If the teachers graduated, whether the benefitted from AA or not, it doesn't matter. They graduated and contained the requirements to be a teacher. I'll give you an example, Baton Rouge High. Those black kids have adequate teaching and facilities and their scores can rank with any kids in the state. Most of the black kids come from struggling middle schools. Their friends go to inner city schools and struggle, they go to a magnet school and excel. It has a lot to do with the school's infrastructure. I know smart black kids who do the work they are given and make 4.0s, but can't make a 18 on the ACT. I know kids who have taken trig and don't know the basics, b/c the teachers didn't do anything all year. So, they aren't prepared for the Math portion of ACT. This is what i mean by inequities in education.

 

Are you questioning the abilities of some of these teachers at the *inner city schools*? If so, you can take that up with the NEA and the state equivalents.
Maybe that is part of the solution? Should the requirements to be a teacher be raised or perhaps altered?
If a kid is making a 4.0 and can't make an 18 on the ACT, unless their is a test-taking disability gene, I think I'd focus at least as hard on the 4.0 part as I would the 18 part.
And who is responsible for the *violence and drugs*. Racists?
Are these racists who are purposely thwarting the ability of young people to learn?
We're getting specific, I'd suggest these are some of the questions and problems and potential solutions that are available rather than racially based preferences.

 

No problem then :thumb:

I have a twist on this whole AA thing of sorts, its got to do a little more with
the struggle between the sexes today.

The woman field goal kicker that played at Colorado for a couple of years.
She got on the team during the Rick Neuhisel era at Colorado and then
Gary Barnett got burnt because the whole thing blew up on him.

The football players didn't respect Katy for being on the team because she
wasn't any good in terms of a football player and she would've never made
the team if she wasn't a woman.

Isn't that a perfect example summed up in one instance?

 

Yes, many of the teachers in these schools are unqualified. The example at BTR High is straight forward. Give these kids opportunities, they will perform. Also, it has to start from kindergarten. Many of these elementary teachers in black schools are ridiculous. Start with good teachers there and the kid will be on the right track to success. If the govt. put an all out effort to establish what we are talking about now, AA could be abolished in less than 10 years. 4.0, but 18 on the ACT. That kills them in college admissions. These kids working hard as they can but b/c some idiot teachers, both black and white, don't know themselves what 2+2 is, these kids are punished in their pursuit of an education. Luckily, I had the support to do well in school. I went to good elementary, middle, and high schools that allowed me to do well in school. When it came to ACT, I was able to go to a camp at Southern that brought my score in line with tops in nation. Many of my friends who did well went to ACT programs the school had. We had opportunities. Give these kids opportunities and they will perform. Why do so many of the black professionals come from HBCU's. It's b/c these schools take chances on kids like the person I mentioned earlier(18 act, 4.0) b/c they know how inept these schools are. They actually teach them something and great things then happen. Look at the new Capitol middle school. Actually giving those kids a respectable building is a start, but unless there is a change in quality of teachers don't expect a change in performance.

 

Sourdoughman, that example doesn't fit b/c it doesn't represent AA. Now if Katy was just as good as the other kickers and got a shot b/c she's a woman and there not any other woman kickers in the league, thats AA.

 

Be my guest when you run into that brick wall, i.e. the NEA and the affiliates.
Herein lies the problem, when you look at the root of the problems, be it poor schools, drug addiction, out of wedlock births or whatever it might be, you are running headfirst into some very, very powerful special interests, some you might not even be aware of.
As a result, the EASY and QUICK *solution* is Affirmative Action.
You don't have to take on the teacher's unions, seek real solutions to the drug problems that do not not involve mass incarceration, take on the *feminist* and homosexual movements and others that have and will continue to destroy the family unit.
Just throw some A-A paint on it and claim that you are *fixing* the problems.

 

Obviously the real answer to all this lies within the inner schools plagued throughout the US. Much of that has been addressed with federal funds when GW increased Title 1 by over 40% and increased the preschool education programs to over a billion dollars. Title I addresses much of the inequities mentioned above but its not race-based, nor is your true argument.

Even with the aforementioned, its obvious the burden of changing our world is us. Too often we look the other way when we could be part of the solution by helping some neighborhood kid struggling with schoolwork or another that's on the wrong path. If everyone took an hour out of their week to make that difference then we would be well on our way to an improved society since we all pay in the end if we don't.

 

Increased funding for poorer schools has been pushed for years, even though I believe AA is a temporary solution, this is the permanent solution.