With that frame of mind, I hope you don't go to church or buy anything any preacher has ever said. By your logic, they are all liars because technically God doesn't say any of that either. Not sure how you can believe in God without believing what is in the Bible...maybe a god but not the God. If you believe in the Bible, our purpose is pretty clearly defined.
The government taking my money (taxes), moreso from the rich, to GIVE to the poor (proposed healthcare plan) pretty much wreaks of redistribution of wealth. The whole point of Socialism is to get away from the "unfairness" of capitalism by lessening the gap between the rich and the poor. Aside from the blatant disregard for logic, it promotes all kinds of terrible things, like motivated people not being rewarded for their hard work thus destroying productivity. Like I said, the healthcare plan isn't full out socialism, but it is a step in that direction.
these obama plans are big government liberal plans. they are liberal by definition, in that they involve lots of government intervention. your idea of "well, i am not a liberal because i only favor trying them out, where a real liberal would be extra excited about trying them out" is ludicrous. your stance is defined by the policy you favor and oppose. and you cant say "well i neither favor nor oppose it, i just let the liberals do whatever they want, so i am moderate. " not opposing something is the same as favoring it. the fact is, your stance on cap and trade alone is enough to make you a left wing liberal. and your claim that you dont really favor it, but you want to give it a try anyways, is enough to demonstrate how unprincipled your liberalism is.
Rush Limbaugh says a lot of things that make a lot of sense and that I am in total agreement with. I admit that freely. I take it that you are implying that I am not worthy of your admiration because of that association. Fine. We disagree politically. Yet I'm puzzled why Obama's associations are of no import. Rev Wright, Tony Rezco, Blag-whatever-vich, Ayers, Dorn? Do I smell a little hypocricy in the wind?
I'll take this as your complete endorsement for Pelosi and Reid and the remainder of this Congress. I'm sure they're happy to know you're marching in step. Maybe they'll reward you for being in their back pocket. For someone who claims to be their own person and not influenced by a party...you sure do love those liberals. :grin:
I think the bill is being rushed. It is so large that we need time for all of the elements to be debated and hashed out before we can make a proper decision. I won't oppose it based on some of the wild claims that have already been discredited. But I won't support it if it doesn't get proper debate, like the Blue Dogs are forcing. It's one reason that I try to get the opponents to lay out their opposition with some examples of a bad ideas in the bill instead of just waving their arms and crying "socialism!" or "Obama is an muslim". Like I try to explain to the extremists, anyone who has already decided that it is good or bad isn't being pragmatic. If it's got bad parts, let's get them removed and pass the good parts. Doing nothing is a poor option with our insurance costs doubling every decade.
if you believe in god you are not agnostic either. i like that you are afraid to admit to extreme views, even about this. if you believe in a creator (and of course there is no evidence for this) then you are not agnostic. the agnostic is non-committal. of course i think agnosticism is a redundant position, given that not having an answer about god is the same as not believing in him, which is the same as atheism. anyways, i am suprised by this revelation that red has faith and is a believer. that is good. wouldnt want to be an extremist.