A price to oil company demagoguery

Discussion in 'Free Speech Alley' started by LsuCraig, Nov 16, 2005.

  1. marcmc99

    marcmc99 Founding Member

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  2. martin

    martin Banned Forever

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  3. marcmc99

    marcmc99 Founding Member

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    Now I assume you've run out of anything of value to add, since you've resorted to attempting to twist my words to make my argument fit your argument. Like I said several times earlier, I support government enforced price ceilings, as long as the government ensures alternative fuel sources are being developed in a timely fashion. Also, I'm not sure why the government would have to take billions more tax payer dollars to enforce these policies. I never said the government should do the research and develpoment.
     
  4. martin

    martin Banned Forever

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    but how would they do that? seriously? communism?

    how would the goverment force people to make alternative fuels? i am guessing this involves lots and lots of taxes and politicians.

    yunno, it wouldnt cost the government a single dime to just allow people to be free from their horrible grasp.
     
  5. marcmc99

    marcmc99 Founding Member

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    Nope, it's not communism. You may call it that, but in case you haven't noticed, there is no such thing and never will be any such thing as an absolute democracy. Certain checks and balances are in place in key areas to ensure our country will continue to remain strong and prosper. That's why we have a Department of Energy, a Department of Agriculture and so forth. No real need for a Department of Clothing or Electronics and such. Those things can be left alone to be worked out by the economic principles you value, because they don't impact every thread of our economy.

    Instead of taxing, they could offer tax breaks. (They did that to consumers for hybrid cars a while back). But, I guess taxes would work as well. Probably would depend on whether republicans or democrats are calling the shots at the time. And, there are all sorts of other means to bring this about, I'm sure you could come up with some if you tried.

    Like I said, we are the government, and it would cost us tremendously to allow energy prices to spiral out of control. Recession then depression before alternatives are created.
     
  6. martin

    martin Banned Forever

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    yes i know, it is unfortunate that these things exist. if we had any brains, both of them would be completely abolished. but we are scared of economic freedom. we dont realize that the more we want the government to protect us, the more we hold back the economy. if these things did not exist, we would have a far more advanced economy already.

    every country in the world is pretty much rich to the extent they are capitalist. free economy= rich. government managed economy = poor. we are one of the richest, because we are one of the more free countries. but we could be far richer. but people want to be told what to do.

    in the face of countless examples of government inefficiency, and the success of private capitalism, people still refuse to accept the obvious.

    their never needs to be "checks" on the free exchange of legal goods. because as long as people are buying and selling things voluntarily, the market finds solutions. the moment you "protect" consumers from voluntary entering into transactions, the market screws up. you cripple innovation and progress. all because you are scared of freedom.
     
  7. marcmc99

    marcmc99 Founding Member

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    If you say so, but you'll never have what you are hoping for. Our country is made up of many smaller issues that form one big picture. There has to be give and take among the numerous smaller issues to preserve the bigger picture and maintain our status as a self-sufficient nation, with the one exception at this point being oil. I want freedom from the oil stranglehold just as much as you, but I don't want to suffer the consequences of reaching that point through the avenue you desire. I believe there is a better way than killing our economy, which I firmly believe will happen if energy prices get to the point they alone will drive the demand for alternative fuels. Whether or not we have the elected officials to do it properly remains to be seen, but now they have their chance. If they can't, get them out and put people in office who can do the job.
     
  8. TigerWins

    TigerWins Founding Member

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    I asked the following question in other threads, but I have not received an answer from anyone who claims oil companies are to blame for the current high prices:

    For the most part, we have enjoyed cheap oil and energy prices for the last 20 years without any help from the government. Oil prices fail to $10 in the late 90s and gas was very cheap. If oil companies can control the price as many suggest, how and why did they allow us to have cheap oil for the better part of the last two decades?
     
  9. marcmc99

    marcmc99 Founding Member

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    Oil companies aren't to blame. We are at the mercy of OPEC when it comes to oil prices. We aren't so popular with these nations, and we are paying for it. We can't control the global crude oil price. The only thing we can do is control the markup our oil companies put on the finished product. I wouldn't say that's fair, but it is what it is.



     
  10. LsuCraig

    LsuCraig Founding Member

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    That's why even if we are looking for alternatives, if we don't want to rely on OPEC, we have to find sources for oil and ways to refine those barrels. Our capacity to find and refine oil has dropped by 60% in the last 20 years. It's a wonder gas isn't much higher than it is. In Europe, it's $6 a gallon because they have even less capability to refine and produce than us. We have oil but we don't drill for it for a number of reasons.
     

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