Why Everyone hates Universal health care

I have no idea what this has to do with calling someone's focus stupid and people who find abortion important weak-minded. That is the ONLY thing my post was about.

And that is why women can't vote and there are still slaves in this country. That is a defeatist attitude that most don't share. It will be tough, no doubt but not impossible. I understand that it is tough to delete anything that the government has put in place (like universal health care will be). But welfare was reformed and health care can be reformed again to stop the disaster that awaits us in 5 to 10 years.

"Stupid" and "weak-mind" do not denote respect.

I have no problem with you having a problem with it. If you think that we should be more worried about the economy that our morals, that is fine. But there are those out there that do not. I am not one of them, but I will defend them. To denigrate people because you don't agree with them is a bullying tatic that I get tired of on these boards.

Nothing has been done because the non-conservative Republicans are turn coat yellow-bellied cowards. The days of trusting middle of the road Republicans needs to be over.

What weak argument are you refering to? The only place in my first post where I pointed out my opinion dealt with my (possibly cynical) view that liberals will use the immigration issue to take more power away from the people to put it in the hands of the government. Every other point I brought up, I just brought up that there are other opinions that are valid (not stupid) and there are many reasonable people (not weak-minded) swayed by them. And the point I made (that you completely ignored) is that you don't need to bring that judgmental/"better than thou" attitude to the table.

What is funny is that I completely agree that abortion is an issue best left alone for now. Of course I think it should wait until people are in office that may be more receptive to it..

 

OK, so I was a bit lazy in my describing my point of view... just trying to reduce my wordiness. Choice also happens when a dude drops his pants. No doubt about it. Conceiving a child is usually a two-person act with equal responsibilty. That fact is actually one of the things that bugs me about abortion, that a woman can have one without the father's consent. I didn't want to get into the details of my opinion of abortion in this thread because that is not what this thread is about and I left out some details on my view. Now I am just about to destroy my attempt to reduce the clutter on this board by type another paragraph that has nothting to do with "Why everyone hates Universal heath care"...

With regards to rape/incest, the woman did not make a choice... hence abortion seems to be an option. I would probably seriously consider an abortion if I were a woman that was raped. But I would hope that the moral fiber in the country could eventually get to the point that women would not feel the need to blame a baby for a rapists actions. We are not there yet, and if I were a woman, I honestly don't think I am there yet emotionally. But divorcing oneself from the emotions of it (impossible, I know), but couldn't pregnancy and birth of a child be viewed as a natural consequence of rape or incest? Is it a continuation of the crime? The price you pay for being a victim? Paying a price as a victim sucks and if we can reduce someone's pain as a victim, I am usually all for it, but I know this will sound cold, but is possibly killing someone worth keeping someones feelings from being hurt? I mean, we don't take a rapist and allow the rape victim to shoot him? Why should we allow the woman to kill the child that was a result of the crime? I dunno, I am definitely on the fence on this one. Morally it looks pretty cut and dry, but emotionally...

 

Who's winning?

 

tigermark, don't mistake defeatism for realism.

 

So sex is only for the act of procreation?

My view is this: Who the hell are you or I to determine what happens with a woman's body? If she can handle the emotional issues that come with abortion, then people should back off. It's a personal decision that can't possibly be understood by anyone else but that person. This country needs to stay out of it's citizen's business.

or logic.

10 Things You Didn’t Know Were in the Health Bill

1. Menu labeling: The legislation mandates that national chains with at least 20 restaurants must post ... calorie counts right next to the menu offering “Big Mac.”
2. Swag disclosure: ... a previously bipartisan idea calling for pharmaceutical reps and device manufacturers to disclose all the goodies they give doctors.
3. Right to pump: Workplaces will have to provide “reasonable” break time and a private location — other than a bathroom — for breastfeeding mothers to pump breast milk for one year after the birth of a child.
4. Postpartum depression: the bill singles out the problem of postpartum depression for expanded funding, worker training, public education and research.
5. Tanning tax: Starting July 1 of this year, there will be a new 10 percent excise tax on indoor tanning services
6. Adoption credit: Beginning with your 2010 taxes, the federal adoption credit goes up by $1,000 to $13,170 per child and now becomes refundable
7. Indian health: The law increases funding and support on tribal lands for behavioral health and substance abuse, health care worker recruitment and facilities construction.
8. Background checks: The Secretary of Health and Human Services is tasked with developing a national system for conducting criminal background checks of prospective health care workers who would deal directly with patients in long-term care facilities or private homes.
9. Abstinence education: ...allocates $250 million for such programs over the next five years.
10. Your W-2: ...the W-2 you receive from your employer (if, hopefully, you have one) will include the cost of employer-provided health care

Little Remarked Upon Provisions of the Health Care Bill | Smart Journalism. Real Solutions. | Miller-McCune Online Magazine

For those who question the source: About Us | Smart Journalism. Real Solutions. | Miller-McCune Online Magazine

Some of this is ridiculous like the abstinence program and the tanning tax. The breast-feeding bit sounds unnecessary. Isn't it already mandated to have breaks during the work-day? Do they reallt need to be labeled for pumping breastmilk? The $250 million for abstinence is really what kills me, though. That's just a ridiculous sum of money for a program that's proven not to work.

 

I actually like numbers 1 and 2.

 

Most of everything that obama is doing has been proven not to work? Why would we let a little thing like history get in the way though? Woodrow Wilson tried this sort of stuff and look what that got him.

 

I think they should provide the time and a room to get pregnant while at work..

 

i'm for that as long as there is a lunch time abortion clinic onsite as well.