Why Everyone hates Universal health care

I check out MSNBC for the psycho lesbian updates. I also check out CNN at night to see if Larry King is still alive. I've got him in a Dead Pool.

 

I should have just went to work before I posted.
You have convinced me from your speech here that you should never vote for a candidate again.
You have no reason at all to waste your time.
Lets just not talk for awhile, you truly are giving me a headache.
I'm not going to respond to your new post, I haven't gotten over this one yet!

 

Prepare to go on my ignore list.

Interesting, not one shred of factual information there.
It will be interesting if you attack other people's links from CNN, MSNBC, etc or if I've been singled out.

I see corporations are bad, evil.

Wow, really, me?
Please explain why people like me are responsible for a two party season.
I don't want anything more? How would you know?

You aren't half as smart as you think you are and I can prove it.
Party trumps person, the minute a republican or democrat votes for an individual that has a different party affiliation than you, you get all the baggage that comes with it since the party in power controls all the committees, presidential appointments, etc.
If you voted for Obama or a "moderate" candidate for president or like Ritter in Colorado for governor you get payoffs to labor unions and the whole left wing of that parties agenda, cap and tax, green energy, etc.

Myself I supported Carter but was too young to vote at the time.
Voted for Reagan and proud of it, Bush 41 yuck, Bush 43 yucker!
I was voting for Perot but cousin talked me out of it.
I have voted republican, the lesser of 2 evils since.
I would like to possibly vote for independents if it doesn't get Dems elected.
My beliefs are in pretty much in line with the founding fathers.
I think Truman and JFK were the last good Dem presidents.
The Dems have moved too far left for me to consider especially after violating the constitution and mandating every American to buy healthcare, health care that the Congress and the president aren't going to be included in and the polls were against.
The last six months have taught you nothing?
Obama ran as centrist but yet we get Pelosi's and the radical lefts health care bill
and they got it done against the will of the people, bribery, corruption at its best.

I think you are delusional, we have a 2 party system, that is fact and reality.
I would prefer a 3 party system but right now that third party only takes away from the 2 parties votes and elects a president with less of a percentage, makes a closer race and the best person for the job out of the two parties may not be the best choice for the job.

You are STILL going on my ignore list.
You jumped to all kind of conclusions about me which you shouldn't have.
You make all kind of wild assumptions and you don't know me.
You don't even understand the realities of our 2 party system.

 

Abe Vigoda > Larry King

I don't vote any more. I let my daughter choose. Dispite my cynicsm, I still want for her to have some hope in our elected leaders. I'll just wait for her to arrive at the same conclusion as I did naturally.

I've braced myself.

Ok. Go!

You didn't post a link from MSNBC, CNN, etc. You didn't even post a link from a news source. You posted a link from a right-wing farce of a website that attempts to pass off it's opinions as news. However, as someone over the age of 30 if you haven't learned that little nugget of truth yet, you're probably the kind of person who just buries their head in the sand.

Just watch cable news and see how it's presented. Very little substance. They mostly ask open-ended questions and leave you to draw your own conclusions by providing you with a possible scenario that happens to be the worst case scenario. Look no further than the hatchet job done of the healthcare plan and the (hilarious) ideas that it will reduce competition for hospitals, slow the creation of new medical technologies and it's unconstitutional.

Only a simpleton would draw that conclusion from what I typed. Corporations allow me to put food on my table, a roof over my head and pay part of my family's health insurance. However, it is incredibly naive to ignore that they have ulterior motives and that's to make a profit. Every day that passes, they must find newer ways to maximize profits and the line of ethics becomes more and more blurry as a result.

Because you typed this:

We have a two party system because people refuse to rise above the fray and vote for candidates that actually represent their best interests. Instead, they get caught up in the yelling and finger-pointing while the people in Washington DC who start the fracas all break bread together in the same exclusive clubs, restaurants, etc. and laugh at the self-perpetuating mess they've created. As long as we think that there are only two options, there will only be two options and neither of them have any incentive for real change.

Stop playing their game because they're ruining my country!

Yes, if "I" vote third party. However, what if "WE" voted third party. If a third political party made up just 15% of the votes in Congress, that would completely throw the entire process on it's head.

Truman was the last honest President. Kennedy was more centrist than given credit for. Clinton gets a horrible rap, but his record is more conservative than most Republicans in my lifetime. You spend too much time looking at the "-R" or the "-D" to the right of the names.

Yeah, it's not unconstitutional. Pretty much every Constitutional Law expert has stated that it will never see the Supreme Court because it would be a slam-dunk against.

Well, it's a GOP idea from 1996 that benefits the Insurance industry. That hardly sounds like a radical leftist idea. Complaints against bribery and corruption are just hilarious at this point because that's simply par for the course in Washington DC, regardless of who we're talking about.

I never denied that we didn't.

Only because the sheep continue to follow the crowd. As a country, we've simply become too stupid to realize this or too complacent to care.

Boo-****ing-hoo. I jumped to conclusions about you from what I read on a message board. It happens. Most people here think I'm a liberal nutbag, but 100% of my friends think I'm a conservative facist. I consider myself to be unencumbered by partisianship and if I'm pissing off people from both sides of thought, then I feel I have accomplish just that.

That's pretty chicken**** of you to fire off a bunch of nonsense, then put me on your ignore list so you can't read how stupid I make you look. Quite possibly the most cowardly thing I have ever seen in TF.com which is hilarious actually because it's just words and conversation. Perhaps no one has ever called you out on your bull**** before and you're taken aback that someone would talk to you this way. Instead of offering something of substance and/or giving me your actual views instead of allowing me to draw conclusions, you whine about a headache and cry when someone doesn't wholeheartedly agree with you. Your solution is to put them on ignore so you won't be forced to read someone point out the ridiculous **** you post or question your beliefs.

If you cant have a conversation with someone you don't see eye-to-eye with, then YOU have no business voting.

I give respect where it is deserved. You have done nothing to earn it.

 

This is why I have said we need political reform.
I disagree with your view about breaking above the fray.
You simply can't get Americans to do that its like saying lets all not pay taxes this year and turn the system upside down.

Again you aren't dealing in reality, it is a 2 party system until we have reform.
I am mainly talking about voting for president here for the record because of the power at stake.

It is the only game in town, I don't like it but again you aren't going to get a majority of Americans to do it.

Again I would love to vote third party but that third party never gets a very good percentage of votes and it usually puts one of the other parties in office.
For a lessor office I may agree but not president, trying to clarify things a little.

You totally don't and still didn't get it so I'll leave it at that.

You have no problem with what has gone in Washington or this health care bill in Washington DC I guess.

Interesting

I do acknowledge there are problems with the parties but I only see you bashing republicans and the GOP here.

I answered you even though I didn't want too.
You respond again and you are talking to yourself.
I don't want your respect.
My whole problem with you is your attitude towards me, very harsh, confrontational not necessarily your message.

I didn't spill any nonsense, I stated that YOU made a case why you shouldn't vote, you don't, you have no need to complain.
You want people to vote for third party and you aren't voting.
I stated that I would like political reform and vote for a third candidate if it didn't get the other parties elected.

I also stated why you should vote for the party of your beliefs in a 2 party system for instance.
Someone who believes abortion is wrong voting for Bart Stupac and his buddies.
They caved and went left to sign health care into law, totally blatant disregard for their beliefs on abortion to side with their party.

I hope you feel better now.
Again if you had a better attitude towards things maybe people would want to talk to you!
No need to continue, this isn't going anywhere!

 

Actually I am convinced the reason we are in the mess of today is because of the people who sway with the wind.
They didn't pay attention to the message they just liked the messenger, popularity contest, etc.
It has very little to do with a d or r already.
If both parties are the same, breaking bread, laughing then none of this really matters.
This seems like a problem already!

 

This is why I said that you and people who think like you are the problem. When people feel that nothing will change, so they use that as an excuse for inaction, guess what?

Nothing will change.

I wonder why?

yeah, you can. We're a country that once endorsed slavery, women and blacks not having the right to vote, segregation of races, alcohol made illegal then legal, etc. The Republican Party was born as very progressive party. The Democratic Party was the party of conservatives, yet here today the roles have reversed. If anything, we're a country with a rich history of embracing change.

Don't tell me that Americans can't or won't change. It's not easy, but it's very possible.

Changing Presidents does nothing. Congress is everything, hence the need for true third party candidates.. Without support from Congress, the President is nothing more than a figurehead. This is why the only way real change will happen is if people rise above the Dem vs. GOP. THAT is the reality.

Because you have failed to explain it.

I always have a problem with what goes on in Washington, but I don't think that they went far enough. Requiring insurance still depends of people being able to make a living. My fear is that this requirement will further water-down the middle class. It's a start, though and I hope we can adjust it in the future when we see where the trends go.

I would have much rather seen them expand Medicare or a similar program like Taiwan, but too many people are too uneducated and buy into the misleading rhetoric far too easily because they're afraid of the unknown. No one really knows how this will all work out, so no one wants to take that bold first step in fear of that failure being pinned on them. Just like the Civil Rights Bill, Social Security and Medicare it will probably turn out to be something that every hates now, but will be glad it happened later. I blame the Democrats for not educating enough people and just being content in knowing that the GOP couldn't stop it from happening. The issue I guess was that the loudest people got the most attention and unfortunately, those where the most uneducated people.

Just because I don't agree with a bill or because I managed to read through pieces of the Constitution and find some vaguely worded passage that I rationalized with myself as being applicable to supporting my point of view doesn't mean it's unconstitutional. Anyone who lives in Louisiana should know that a government entity can indeed force you to purchase insurance or penalize you for failing to purchase insurance.

There's plenty of Democrat-bashing going on around here, so I see no reason for me to chime in with "I agree". Besides, I did not bash the GOP. I argued against a point and it just so happens that the GOP is behind it. Had the Democrats been behind it, then I would have "bashed" Democrats.

I take issue with the word "bash" anyway because I haven't bashed anyone. I have merely pointed out the massive blind spots that you seem to have when it comes to the Republican Party.

Ummm... get over it?

There is no party that mirrors my beliefs. Mostly because I refuse to be pigeon-holed into a black and white world of Democrat or Republican. The world is made of many shades of gray.

I don't care. Abortion is one of those knee-jerk political causes designed to coerce votes from weak-minded people. It's a personal choice and none of my business. I'm much more concerned about jobs, taxes, national security, our military action and the like to allow something stupid like abortion, same-sex marriage or immigration reform distract me from something that really matters.

If I have to change to please other people or get them to talk to me, then I'm not really interested in discussing anything with such shallow people. Chances are that they don't have anything to offer to the conversation and they're better off remaining quiet. I have little patience for willful ignorance and I doubt that changes any time soon.

 

MLU why don't you run for office. You got my vote man.

 

Local News | UW panelists say lawsuits challenging health bill lack merit | Seattle Times Newspaper

I added links to profiles for three of the four panelists...

 

they are all clearly commies and their words have no value to real conservatives.