News Stephan Hawking Declares There is No God

Discussion in 'Free Speech Alley' started by Bengal B, Sep 26, 2014.

  1. mancha

    mancha Alabama morghulis

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    Science has and continues to revealed the mysteries that faith has attributed to the work of God. When it comes to the ultimate question of all; How did the universe begin? You can follow a scientific theory or you can sing "because the bible tells me so".
     
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  2. Winston1

    Winston1 Founding Member

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    I hold that Hawing cannot hold a candle to Einstein's accomplishments. As far as the rest of the statement you are correct.

    Red Atheism is as improvable as faith in the existence of a God. It is a belief...a faith and an officially recognized religion by the DOD. To be an atheist you have to have faith there is no God.
     
  3. Winston1

    Winston1 Founding Member

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    MLU arrogance is ignoring the great works done in the name of God by people such as ML King Jr, Gandhi, the current Pope, Mother Theresa, (I name Christians because I know of them I'm sure there are many good of all faiths who do good works in the name of their faith). How about one of my assistant rectors who gave up a very lucrative law practice to go to divinity school and volunteer a rector and as head of the Seamen's outreach. What about the poor pastors in churches of all denominations through out the world who sacrifice life and liberty and wealth to bring their faith to others?

    There are so many including the early apostles, Mohammad, Buddha through out history through today who have been moved by faith in God to do good works in his name. What about the pastors who lead the abolition movement in England and the US. Are Wilberforce and the like guilty as you charge? There are millions whose simple faith guide them in life and give them strength to do good works. Even the doctor who went to Liberia and caught Ebola what about him did he do it for filthy lucre?

    I am sorry for you and your bitterness that you ignore all the good works done in the name of faith by so many for the failings of a few. Your arrogance for condemning the whole for a few is bigotry of the first degree.
     
  4. Winston1

    Winston1 Founding Member

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    Do you understand the difference between religion and faith? Yes as science advances many mysteries that were thought to be miracles are shown to be physical phenomena and that will continue. Yes religions struggle with the advancement of science yet understanding that there the hope expressed by faith is one of the keys to humanity advancing to a better place.
    Science will never be able to tell us how to live life as better men and give us the inspiration to treat our neighbor as we would wish to be treated.
    Science a tool to be used to answer the question of how but not answer the ultimate question......WHY?
     
  5. red55

    red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

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    Einstein did not try to use science to prove God. I know of no scientist who does. Choosing to have faith does not constitute scientifically justifying it.

    By definition atheism is a disbelief in God. It doesn't require any proof to disbelieve. They simply acknowledge the utter lack of proof.

    It is in NO WAY a faith. And the DoD does NOT "officially" recognize religions. It simply has a code to identify religious preferences including the LACK of one. There are dog tags that say "Pastafarian" and "Jedi Knight". "Flying Spaghetti Monster" would be OK if it was not too many characters. They use "Atheist / FSM"

    http://www.venganza.org/2011/07/fsm-in-the-military/

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Nonsense. They simply recognize that there is no evidence of God. No faith to it at all.
     
  6. mancha

    mancha Alabama morghulis

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    Ok. Religion is institutionalized faith. The limit of science may be explaining the physical world. Faith was born out of a belief that the unexplained phenomena was a result of God and his higher purpose for us. But science stills pushes the boundaries of faith. Every how has a why. It is the cause and effect relationship that underlies all things. Science can explain all of the how's and why's. The faith in a higher purpose relies on a blind assumption without the how's.

    We can have hope and advance to a better place without Faith because that is in our DNA. It is a part of humanity. It starts with family.
     
  7. red55

    red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

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    Of course.

    But neither does faith. As you mentioned, religions are creations of Men to satisfy phenomenon that they could not understand. Until God goes on CNN and explains the why's, we must consider WHY also to be the guesses of men.
     
  8. Winston1

    Winston1 Founding Member

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    I didn't say he did..I said he had faith and he did make a comment along the lines of the more I learn about physics the more I believe in the existence of God.

    The rest of our disagreement is akin to two medieval theologians arguing about how many angels reside on the head of a pin. Faith...Belief?????
     
  9. red55

    red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

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    Three.

    It may be a fine line, but it ain't invisible. Faith is indeed a belief, but belief is a much broader concept. There are many kinds of belief. Deductive reason is also a belief and it has nothing whatsoever to do with faith.
     
  10. MLUTiger

    MLUTiger Secular Humanist

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    Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

    This is what it boils down to in me. It's a common verse. One I learned when I was a young child in "Bible Drills" and one I used during many mission trips where I witnessed and preached. It was a while before I finally reflected on its meaning after all those years of regurgitating it at people because that's how you witness and win souls for Christ. When I actually applied that verse to my own life, I realized that I didn't possess faith. My actions were not because I really felt that there was a god who sent his son to be born of a virgin, who walked on water, turned water into wine, etc. A god who didn't want us to eat pork, shellfish, to allow us to stone adulterous wives, own slaves and ensure that we worshiped only him and no other gods. A god who left ambiguous instructions for life "through" men of influence over the years in a book that wielded those tomes over the ignorant for generations as a fear tactic.

    I don't have faith. I don't really believe those stories, which are as credible as Santa and the Easter Bunny.

    It doesn't matter what my (your) actions are if I don't have faith. If god is real, then he really knows if you have faith. It's pointless to pretend, so going to church without the belief that all of those stories are real is not going to help me. I'm wasting my Sundays pretending to believe in something that I do not in hopes that one day it works out in the end.

    So, to answer your question (What it you're wrong?): That's not faith. That's "covering your bases" and if that's the reason you're doing it then according to the Bible, you're going to hell right along with me if it even exists. The only difference is that I now have Sundays free to do as I please and you spend your life in fear.

    If you're a Republican, you're not a Christian anyway...
     
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