As I read this debate, I see that there is a lot of pride involved in the sense that Catholics are wrong because their form of worship doesn't agree with another form. It illustrates the huge difference between Faith and religion. They are two radically different entities. Faith is a gift...a gift that comes from God. The direction is from God to man. Through Faith, God reaches out to man. Religion, on the other hand is man's reaching out to God. The direction is from man to God. As different as Faith and religion are, they are confused because they are intimately related....one is a call and the other is a response. That is the definition of a relationship. That is the nature of love. Man is born with a desire for God because man was created by God and for God through his infinite love and wisdom. And God never stops drawing man to himself...He never stops reaching out to mankind. Only in God will we ultimately find truth because truth is a reality and God created all reality. As for scientific truth and spiritual truth, they are one and the same because they come from the same single source. Truth can not contradict truth because God can not contradict himself....He IS truth. Apparent contradictions between science and religion occur because man doesn't fully know both scientific truth and Scriptural truth. But ultimately, there can be no contradiction between the two truths. Because we were created in the image and likeness of God, we seek God and are called to know and love Him. But to know that He exists and to love Him requires Faith. Faith is certainty that God exists in the absence of absolute, scientific proof. God has revealed Himself to us through creation and through miracles like the resurrection. But even though many people saw Jesus die and saw Jesus conquer death through His resurrection, many of us reject that Truth because we reject Faith. God didn't reveal himself scientifically...absolutely....to each and every one of us individually...beyond the shadow of our doubt. We're so self centered that we demand that God reveals himself to us on OUR terms. Well, those are not His terms...He requires Faith. Religious people are way too hung up on their own religious response to God's call and they don't even recognize God's call to us. They lack Faith...and Faith demands that we become less prideful, egotistical and self centered. Religion is full of hypocrisy...and it drove Jesus nuts as well as us. But the existence of hypocrisy and sin that drives us to reject a particular religion, or religion itself doesn't justify a rejection of Faith. But God certainly allows us to reject Faith. He doesn't force it on us at all....we have the free will to do so.
Already done. Move along, these are not the droids you are looking for. And they can be right. I repeat, I'm not trying to change church doctrine or your narrow mind. Just pointing out the holes in them that are clear to those not indoctrinated. She just get Godlike treatment (Immaculate Conception, the Assumption, etc.), that no other figure in the Bible get except God and Son-O-God. Explain to us how that works exactly. I suspect there are a number of contradictory scriptures to offer. No, I do not accept what YOU understand. Keep hoping, chief. Don't hold your breath. The rule of the duck applies to those who don't hold with the complex and contradictory rules of Catholicism. And how about those idols of worship? Blatant violations of the Second Commandment.
Steve what about our friends from overseas that do not reject faith, they love faith, but they do reject the reality that amazing jesus died for our sins or did nott really die because he is fine? What about them? Will they be ok or will god burn their souls for all eternity for rejecting the good news about jeebus
Red you can't understand the trinity. It's not that the trinity concept is fucking nonsense it's that you and I are mindless clods that can't understand if someone is one thing or three things
Ah, Steve. Ain't mythology great! You make me want to drink blood and nibble upon a corpse every Sunday.
Red not to argue but to fill in... The Trinity is the construct of the Council of Nicea in the 320's. Constantine just having converted and taken the throne wanted to use Christianity to help unify the empire. Two bishops Ariananus and Athanstatias (I'll never spell them right) were battling over who what the relationship between god, jesus & the holy ghost was. Arian made Jesus subordinate to god, in efect destroying monotheisum. Athan promoted that they were 3 emenations of the same being. Basically Constantine sided with Athanstatias and from there we get the Nicene Creed. That and it's later construct The Apostle's creed are the basis for the Christian faith. If you are catholic or protestant the three in one concept is what you were baptized under and if you attend church profess at every service. You cannot truly be a christian or more correctly a member of a church unless you accept the statement of belief in those two creeds. That point and the other tenents of all Christian churches are contained in the creeds. All other additions are baggage added to fit societial desires (Cathloics and protestants share this burden). Many are due to faith and many more are due to the requirements of the times. Remember the Catholic Church was the only institution available to maintain and stability when the western roman empire collasped in the century after Constintine. It took on civil duties and often had to cloak them in religous clothing. Likewise many protestant faiths evolve from civil issues. Look at the Anglican and Luthuran churches for example. Both its attackers and defenders often forget it has nearly 2000 years of evolution. Like DNA there are key components needed to express itself and alot of junk in the trunk that once was needed but is not not helpful.
We should remove the veil of religion, an institution that leads us on the path that other men want us to go. We should remove this garment and stand naked in the eyes of God. Like Reeva Steenkamp is doing right now.
