dont click here if you're squeamish. i stumbled across this by accident. im not clicking the videos. saw a few long ago. that was enough. http://www.barenakedislam.com/category/beheadings-graphic
So it's our fault they are all a bunch of pussies now, or its our fault because we won't let them fight or what? Explain, this is not my area clearly.
I agree....we gave Iraq democracy; they didn't have the stones to keep it. On my, "you go in on the ground or you let someone else do it" comment, I vote for someone else. And if we can support our allies with air power, fine. Just don't have any illusions that we can "win" with air power alone.
Said it before I will say it again, a few well placed plague infested rats should take care of it all.
Conflicting Interests. They are as politically polarized as we are with conflicting agendas. Turkey is trying to do it all and they can't. Turks want to be European like their NATO allies and join the EU but they are just too Middle Eastern in culture and politics, which they also embrace. They have always played off all sides against each other since before Alexander. They are the ISIS conduit for recruits, money, trade, and oil. Turkey is where all of those Toyota pickups came from. Now Turkey has "joined the fight" against ISIS by attacking the Kurds who are the only local group fighting ISIS worth supporting with everything we've got. Kurds have played ball since the beginning and have been willing to fight for their turf. Turkey despises and fears the Kurds and that is the problem. And that is putting Turkey in conflict with the US and the Europeans again. And now with Saudi Arabia and the Gulf States. Turkey needs to get its shit together badly. Letting this ISIS thing turn Turkey into a conduit for jihadism into Europe will get Turkey into deep shit with their NATO allies and they can kiss that EU membership goodbye.
we don't need to put guys on the ground and I dont want any more of our guys there. my statement was when they show thier ass. lay down the hammer. it can be done, it takes a will that we don't possess anymore. and yes I understand that ww2 was total war and this isn't. my point is that if your going to use force then that is the only way to use it. otherwise your waisting time abd lives.
How do you figure that? We are actively striking jihadist targets in Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Somalia, and Yemen. Whenever they show their ass. Both drone missile attacks and air strikes. Sounds like laying down the hammer to me. That is a prime point for when we make the decision to go to an all-out war. We should only do it when our national interests are at stake, when we have a plan to win it quick and then leave on our own terms. It's the American way of war--quick, short, and extremely violent. We simply cannot get mired in another Vietnam or Iraq nation-building experiment with a bitterly hostile occupied population. But these underground terrorists and jihadists have to be hit hard in targeted strikes whenever we find them and we are doing just that. Not to mention putting a ton of economic pressure on them. This will be a long fight but we need to do it on our terms, not on theirs. They want a knife fight on their turf. We want to blow them up as targets of opportunity emerge.
You and I agree on one thing solidly... we don't need to be drawn into an on the ground fight. that is fruitless and isis wants. but I disagree that what we are doing now will break them. we should wholesale bomb every suspected place they are. there will be casualties some unintended, but I bet that all the true civilians have fled. what's left by them is either supporters or at least they are aapathetic to the isis cause. so in my opinion they are targets also. at some point we must make support of these turds painful enough that people don't want them around.
I understand exactly what you are saying, but I don't think it is that simple. There are a lot of civilians in the ISIS-controlled area, millions of them. Many, if not most, of them are not fans of ISIS in any way, their life has gone to hell because of ISIS. They don't really offer much support to ISIS, they are only shields for ISIS to hide behind. The ones caught up in religious zealotry will begin to question why Allah is once again not leading them to any victories. Even those that are Sunnis who support ISIS have women and children that are innocent. Wholesale slaughter of hundreds of thousands of Arabs will lose us all of our middle eastern support as well as international support. Moreover it is not guaranteed to eliminate ISIS. Guerrilla fighters have a knack for hiding out and resisting. We actually did bomb the shit out of North and South Vietnam and it didn't do anything but turn the civilians against us. It is futile to try to "kill them all". It makes much more sense to target the jihadists and that is exactly what we are doing. In the end it will take a ground effort from other Arab countries to suppress ISIS and liberate the captive population. We are also doing that by isolating them from money, supplies, weapons, and recruits. It will take time, but so would a genocide of Iraqi and Syrian civilians. Life is getting tough in the Islamic State. They can't get oil out and they can't get parts to keep pumping it. It is a desert and they aren't producing enough food. They are not gaining any allies and the copycat terrorists abroad are pinpricks that neither hurt their enemies nor help ISIS at home. Patience is the key to defeating ISIS. They have little sustainability. We steadily degrade their capabilities through airstrikes and economic starvation, train up and arm coalition Arab forces to deal with them on the ground, and don't be distracted by their atrocities that are intended to suck us into another quagmire.
