Log in or Sign up

How does everyone feel about the POTUS

Discussion in 'Free Speech Alley' started by LaSalleAve, Feb 8, 2013.

Page 10 of 17

red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

Joined:

Oct 21, 2002

Messages:

45,195

Likes Received:

8,736

MLUTiger said: ↑

how is imminent defined? What proof is required? From the white paper it looks like all it takes is someone to simply tell the pilot to shoot. Lots of wiggle room there...
Click to expand...

"informed, high-ranking official" is code for the President of the United States. The buck stops there. POTUS can delegate this responsibility in wartime to the Secretary of Defense or the CIA chief, but they rarely do so.

What abuses of this responsibility have happened that you object to?

red55, Feb 10, 2013

#91
MLUTiger Secular Humanist

Joined:

Aug 9, 2001

Messages:

4,606

Likes Received:

810

red55 said: ↑

"informed, high-ranking official" is code for the President of the United States. The buck stops there. POTUS can delegate this responsibility in wartime to the Secretary of Defense or the CIA chief, but they rarely do so.
Click to expand...

You're not naive enough to think that. You're making assumptions, but if that were true then there would be no need to use vague terms. They would say "Executive" or "President" instead of "high-ranking official".

red55 said: ↑

What abuses of this responsibility have happened that you object to?
Click to expand...

Red herring. My awareness is not relevant.

MLUTiger, Feb 10, 2013

#92
gyver Rely on yourself not on others.

Joined:

Sep 29, 2011

Messages:

2,001

Likes Received:

717

red55 said: ↑

Come back when you are sober.
Click to expand...

If he can decide whose a terrorists and have them killed. Then whoever thinks bArry is a terrorists should be able to whack his ass. I think that list is growing on a national level. Arming the Muslim brotherhood in Egypt, Syrian rebels ,aka al quaida, and Mexican drug cartels falls under the heading of treason. He authorized, he's responsible.

gyver, Feb 10, 2013

#93
Winston1 Founding Member

Joined:

Sep 5, 2010

Messages:

12,048

Likes Received:

7,423

red55 said: ↑

Amigo, I wish you would learn how to use multiple quotes. I wish I would as well but I don't have all your free time. I work for a living.

Don't be obtuse, do you really imagine that I am in charge of the drone strikes? You certainly talk as if you are making statements with such certainty.The limits of citizenship is in the Constitution for all to read. Again not true as I pointed out earlier with in this OP with cites.We freely elected an Executive and Commander in Chief.Yes we did and we freely have the option of changing our mind...ask GHW Bush and J Carter

Then what exactly is your issue? You keep bringing him up. You brought him up I only responded.You have not offered a single instance where this drone policy has been abused to target Americans not actively involved with Al Qaeda. Well over 99% of the drone strikes targeted foreign agents of Al Qaeda.Red you continually ignore the point that the issue is not drone strikes but the lack of structure and checks on their use. Also the negative concequences

Exactly! Congress authorized war against Al Qaeda. They do not get involved in operational matters like rules of engagement, which are set by the Commander in Chief. The very fact that rules of engagement is at play defines this action as international warfare. ROE are not used for domestic operations. Instead, use of force by US forces in such situations is governed by Rules for the Use of Force (RUF).That is ridiculous Red..are you saying there are plans to use armed forces in the US? Get it through your thick skull the unrestricted use of drones whether it be on foreigners or US citizens needs to be better structured. That doesn't mean I am for cottling those who fight us or defend them. I believe there are two issues that make it not the best solution. First is that it is a short term solution. We gather no intelligence as we did from those captured in the field. Without rendition OBL would still be around. AQ has adapted and spread like cancer. They aren't defeated but are in Syria, Libyia, Yemen etc etc etc and have changed their short term focus. Drone attacks also create more AQ followers for every one killed. That is reason to question unrestricted use. There is the moral component two. You are comfortable with collateral killing and wounding of children not in combat when they are known to be near the target? I am not and believe there is a difference between unintentional collateral damage and accepting it with knowledge that it will happen.

Not many are calling for it at all! Exactly 11 Congressmen. The other 98% have not called for anything of the kind. 16% of the senate and 34% of the Ds in the senate have a problem with it and the Ds are going against a popular and petty and vindictive leader that doesn't raise concern? When it comes to drone strikes, the fight in Washington has no parallel in the general public. 83% of the American public approves of the drone strikes.Interesting use of statistics Red.Does that mean because it is popular it is right? 84% of southerners supported slavery and segregation...were they right?

Washington Post: The American Public loves drones

I understand your concern that such power could be abused. But it has not been abused in the 12 years that it has been in place. It has been highly effective militarily. If abuse ever did occur, THEN the existing checks and balances would come into play. If it ain't broke . . . AGain the whole point of LaSalle's post was that there are no checks and the potential for abuse was real. President Obama has shown he is willing to ignore the law and constitution when it suits him with the recess appointments abuse that has been ruled unconstitutional...what should I believe he won't do so with drones?

No one thought that White House officials would reveal a covert CIA operative either. But when it happened, it could not be kept secret and persons were brought to trial for it. No one thought that a President would use government official to spy on political opponents, but when it happened it could not be kept secret and a President was forced to resign. SO you say if senators who know much more than you have a problem that isn't the canary in the coal mine?

The check and balances are already there and they work.You can say that till the cows come home but there are none.
Click to expand...

Winston1, Feb 11, 2013

#94
LSUMASTERMIND Founding Member

Joined:

Nov 15, 2007

Messages:

12,992

Likes Received:

2,461

gyver said: ↑

If he can decide whose a terrorists and have them killed. Then whoever thinks bArry is a terrorists should be able to whack his ass. I think that list is growing on a national level. Arming the Muslim brotherhood in Egypt, Syrian rebels ,aka al quaida, and Mexican drug cartels falls under the heading of treason. He authorized, he's responsible.
Click to expand...

umm i dont know if you read, but he denied Hillarys request to arm Syrian Rebels.

LSUMASTERMIND, Feb 11, 2013

#95
gyver Rely on yourself not on others.

Joined:

Sep 29, 2011

Messages:

2,001

Likes Received:

717

Food prices higher. Taxes higher. Gas higher. Insurance more expensive. Nations credit rating downgraded. Unemployment on rise. GDP falling. More unrest in Middle East. Korea has a nuke. $6.5 trillion added to national debt. Welfare recipients at record levels. Slowest economic recovery ever. 2 months to respond to hurricane sandy. Bypasses congress whenever possible.fast and furious. Benghazi. No budget in over 4 years. Never met with his jobs council. 3 of his NLRB appointments ruled unconstitutional. And gutting our military. Great job he's done. Jimmy Carter loves him though.

gyver, Feb 11, 2013

#96
gyver Rely on yourself not on others.

Joined:

Sep 29, 2011

Messages:

2,001

Likes Received:

717

LSUMASTERMIND said: ↑

umm i dont know if you read, but he denied Hillarys request to arm Syrian Rebels.
Click to expand...

My bad. He ignored the Syrian uprising just like the Iranians Arab spring. But he has no problem supporting Muslim brotherhood though.
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/...gress-gives-1-5-billion-to-muslim-brotherhood

gyver, Feb 11, 2013

#97
LSUMASTERMIND Founding Member

Joined:

Nov 15, 2007

Messages:

12,992

Likes Received:

2,461

gyver said: ↑

My bad. He ignored the Syrian uprising just like the Iranians Arab spring. But he has no problem supporting Muslim brotherhood though.
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/...gress-gives-1-5-billion-to-muslim-brotherhood
Click to expand...

dude you cant have it both ways, you really need to fall back and think for a few seconds, you criticize him for arming the rebels which he didnt, then you criticize him for not getting involved.
which is it, it really goes to show you that you have no interest in deductive reasoning, intellectual integrity and balance.
i still love you though.

LSUMASTERMIND, Feb 11, 2013

#98
red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

Joined:

Oct 21, 2002

Messages:

45,195

Likes Received:

8,736

MLUTiger said: ↑

You're not naive enough to think that. You're making assumptions, but if that were true then there would be no need to use vague terms. They would say "Executive" or "President" instead of "high-ranking official".
Click to expand...

I said exactly what I think. Is your own statement not presumptuious?

MLUTiger said: ↑

Red herring. My awareness is not relevant.
Click to expand...

But your unawareness is. The fact that abuses have not happened is highly suggestive that the system is working and the balances in place are adequate.

red55, Feb 11, 2013

#99
red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

Joined:

Oct 21, 2002

Messages:

45,195

Likes Received:

8,736

Winston1 said: ↑

Amigo, I wish you would learn how to use multiple quotes. I wish I would as well but I don't have all your free time. I work for a living.
Click to expand...

Well, I work for a living too, jackass, and have for a long time. And I don't have the time to cut and paste a response to you from this mess. If you can't figure out how to use quotes, then you can't have figured out much about the topic.

red55, Feb 11, 2013

#100

(You must log in or sign up to reply here.)

Page 10 of 17

Share This Page