the whole cinco de mayo/american flag incident in another thread made me start thinking about the flag and free speech. the american flag can be burned without fear of arrest as an expression of free speech. while i do not agree with doing so and find it incredibly disrespectful, i do understand why it is protected under free speech. (although i believe those that do desecrate do not understand or respect how and why they have free speech and other freedoms.) however, i have a hard time wrapping my head around people who support and respect the flag being denied the right to wear or fly it. those that have a problem with the flag are denying (or trying to deny) the same rights to others that they themselves demand, ironically the very rights that flag represents. or those originally from other countries having problems with the flag. (i mean, im sure no one is holding them hostage here.) some examples i found.... from may, 2009 from may, 2010 (and posted in another thread) from oct, 2009 from aug, 2006, the mexican flag above the american flag. i just dont get it. people that are offended by the flag demand for themselves the very freedoms the flag represents. persons from other countries coming to this country having a problem with the flag, or wanting their flag placed above old glory, yet at the same time, demand the "right" to be in this country. all the hypocrisy is mind boggling.
neighborhoods and offices should certainly be free to tell you not to fly flags according to whatever rules, or have you evicted, i dont see any problem there. i actually really enjoy when a flag is burned and see that there are many reasons to do so, many injustices by our government. as far as the teacher telling the kid not to draw the flag, that just seems to be another relatively incident of a person in authority at a school being a moron, which seems to be a regular component of the news cycle. also the story seems a bit contrived and untrue. it is also the case that people that are super hardcore about flying the flag are often idiots, the kind of folks that cling to guns and religion. its just a symbol, no need to get too worked up over it.
you miss the point. the condo flap was because someone "might be offended". there were no rules in place. that is why i did not include the instances of where people lived in condos that had bylaws in place regulating the flying of the flag. if someone signed onto that, they are doing something in voilation of what they signed onto. i find it hypocritical to try deny someone the right to fly the flag when they demand the very freedoms the flag represents, if there are no rules and bylaws in place, but rather based on "offensiveness". the freedom of speech that allows the flag to be burned is the same freedom that allows one to fly or wear it.
Then they can't be evicted for it. I'm a a landlord and the rental laws are strict if a tenant is smart enough to know them. They can't evict someone by telling them to move, even if they stop paying rent. They have to file for legal eviction with the sheriff and show just cause. Judges tend to side with tenants because all landlords are Snidely Whiplash, you see. I make sure that every little thing that I will not allow is a part of that lease. And they keep coming up with things that I object to, but I bite my tongue until their lease comes up and then I put it in the new lease. The lease once said "no waterbeds". It now says "no water-filled furniture of any kind" after a tenant had what could only be called a water bean-bag chair that ruined a hardwood floor. But I couldn't evict her because it wasn't a "waterbed". But landlords have to be wise. Not everything you can put into a lease is legal. For instance you can't say you won't rent to people with children. I'm sure they can say that no flags of any kind are permitted for aesthetic reasons concerning property appearance, I don't think they can prohibit a US flag on a tenants vehicle. That is a stretch.
This is the one that worked me up below. Anyway, why would anyone be offended by Old Glory and still be in the States? What other country would put up with taking down the flag of the country you are standing in because it would offend? Medal Of Honor Winner Won’t Be Forced To Stop Flying The Flag A homeowner’s association has backed off on a demand that a 90-year-old Medal of Honor winner take down the 21-foot flagpole from which the veteran flies the U.S. flag. Medal Of Honor Winner Won?t Be Forced To Stop Flying The Flag
i didnt include that one because of the argument it was based on the flag pole, not the flag. what has me floored is people with a problem with the flag itself. that they find it "offensive", and are trying to keep the flag from being flown not because of the structure holding it, or any rules in place of how and when it is to be flown, but because they flat out have a problem with something that represents the freedoms they enjoy. i remember a conversation of that here, tho i dont remember the thread. i'll have to see if i can dig it up. edit: found it. here it is.... http://www.tigerforums.com/free-speech-alley/93090-hoa-tells-medal-honor-recipient-take-down-his-flag.html
The "offensiveness" of the flag should be irrelevant. Most people find the burning of the flag offensive but it is protected and allowed. Objecting to raising our flag in this country, and that being upheld, is symptomatic of what is wrong with us at the core. It's just ridiculous.
as long as it is stupid individuals and goofy condo boards or whatever, i dont see much of an issue. i dont see much of a reason to care about the flag. symbolism is kinda stupid. a far more dangerous issue the the limits placed on free speech by the government, like the campaign finance reform nonsense. also i should note that the story involving the mexicans is clearly a protest, which i agree with. and the story regarding the kid drawing the flag is almost certainly somewhat made up. and the veteran was clearly violating the guidelines of the community and is in the wrong and should shut his stupid mouth. and the hospital office story? so what. offices set their own rules. we dont own their office so we are not to be concerned about what they allow. the flag represents a free country where business is owned by free private folks that are free to make their own rules. if you want to run a flag-free workplace, good for you. seems like a decent idea, flags are gauche.
Can't hurt people's feelings anymore. But it seems that the minority are the ones who want to fly the flags. I remember when NOT flying the flag was disgraceful.
Burn an American flag in the United States and it's a freedom of speech/expression issue. Burn a Mexican (or any other) flag in the United States and you're inciting a riot. :dis: It's similar to hate crimes. They only work one way. You have to love liberal double standards! :thumb:
