Edward Snowden.....hero or traitor?

a la Vince Foster?

 

yep, but don't tell the old cranky one anything like that. There is NO WAY, and I mean NO WAY POSSIBLE that the clintons, or the CIA, or the secret service, or some backwoods ark hillbilly that owed the clintons a favor could have ever done something like that. Its just not possible.

 

I've been away on vacation with the family but have been following the Snowden case and it seems to me that this guy is no doubt a traitor. After reportedly handing over four lap tops of top secret data to the Chinese, all doubt has been removed from this case. Furthermore, the more I think about it, if he is so convinced of his correctness why wouldn't he lawyer up and take on the US government in the court system and through the media. If this guy loves freedom and freedom of speech so much then why is he running to China and Russia? These are not havens for free political speech. Also, the more I think about it and the more that is uncovered, I wonder who is really pulling the strings behind Edward Snowden. Is it Glenn Greenwald, the journalist from the The Guardian, (who in my opinion my be a traitor as well for aiding and abetting), or is it a foreign government who wants to poke a finger in the eye of the US? Where does a 29 year old get the means to evade the US government? I find it highly unlikely that he is acting alone, and my guess that he is being partly aided by Julian Assange and Wikileaks. Either way, I would like to see him extradited back to the states and to face trial.

On another note, the Wikileaks guy, Julian Assange, is in the same boat as far as I am concerned. Wikileaks has begun acting like a nation-state and if they are going to do so then they should be prepared to be treated as a hostile nation state. Wikileaks is responsible for moving him around with an attorney and a "diplomat," which is only a Wikileaks representative.

 

This has been established. They are working with him to try to get asylum in Ecuador although it sounds like they pulled a double head fake and sent him to Cuba.

 

I'm pretty sure the Chinese knew we spied on them. Snowden just made it public. There isn't much you want get away with online that doesn't leave some kind of trail. Also, Snowden released evidence that water may in fact be wet. Meanwhile, the NSA has a program that illegally monitors and stores so much ill-gotten information they built a facility in Utah that houses acres of servers, powered by over 65 megawatts to hold it all. It's not bad enough that they obtained it, but they're keeping it so they can refer back to it anytime they feel like it.

But yeah, go ahead and focus on the guy who exposed it...

 

If there were not broad political consensus about the effectiveness of these programs I might be more sympathetic to your position. But since it is a known fact that these programs have stopped terrorist attacks and since there is absolutely zero evidence that this information has been used against ordinary citizens then I question your authority on the matter.

Further, this guy that you are willing to champion has no interest in the national security of the US or he wouldn't have shared the information, four laptops worth, with the Chinese government. If he was really interested in shaking things up in the US he would have done so thru the media here in the US who are more than capable of protecting the guy from the government by publicizing the hell out of it. But when you go to a foreign government, especially a shadow enemy of the US, and share state secrets you cease to be a whistle blower and become a traitor.

Lastly, if you think this guy is acting alone or that he is on some moral crusade, think again. It will take time but he true motivations will soon enough come to light and I guarantee you he isn't the Robin Hood you think he is.

 

I don't think he ever got on the plane to cuba.....last I heard he was still in Russia.

 

Just drone him and move on. People will forget in a few weeks.

 

Maybe I am just an ol intel guy, but we are in a war, with no rules and we have to stop every big attack and the enemy has to just get past us once, or twice.

Boston, no disrespect intended, was peanuts. There are real, HUGE threats out there and a number have already been stopped by all sorts of means.

Too many people lack an iota of the big picture. The War by Radical Islam is real, and when (not if) they get past us and do something else, beyond terrible, the same people raising hell today will be asking why we did not know.

We have (the us intel community, that is) has done WAY WORSE than tracked emails, or phone calls whatever. The problem is if they are not PERFECT, we all lose. It is really hard to be PERFECT if you are constrained, in any way.

Hell, I am willing to make ANY SACRIFICE to prevent another 9/11. If you want to track my frequent pees and less frequent poops, put a damn camera in my bathroom, if it will help us take down a couple of Islamist. Anytime.

Having said that, the funniest thing in the whole shit show is the outrage expressed by the Conservatives. They would have done this in a New York minute, without thinking, but they act like we are under the eye of BIG BROTHER for the first time. It is funny, even though it is pathetic.

Oh, at so many levels we, the rooskies, and the chinese know exactlly who and what is going on and who is doing what to whom.

 

Their effectiveness does not matter when it violates the Constitutional Rights of our citizens. Dragging rapists into the street might be pretty effective as well, but it doesn't make it right. We have laws for a reason.

I have read nothing that suggests that he "shared" the information. I have read that it was accessed by the Chinese government and they "managed to drain" which doesn't sound like it was given freely or winningly. We're talking about a government with a proven track record of not caring about the human rights of it's own citizens, so I doubt they will bat an eye at violating or threatening to violate the right of an American citizen that has pissed off the American government. All of this is speculation, but that's what passes for news these days so I'm going to take liberty with it for myself. If his intention was to sneak the information to China, then why didn't he go to the Chinese directly instead of Hong King? The Chinese have proven time and time again that they will do what they wish regardless of the protests of the American Government.

As for the information that was shared, how do we know what it was? What we do know is that this information he collected he did so for the purpose of sharing it with the world. He is quoted and saying that he purposely selected specific items that would not jeopardize lives in the field, but would provide enough evidence of the intrusive and illegal nature of the PRISM program. In other words, China just received leaked copies of information that Snowden was releasing or already released anyway. I have no confirmation of this, but based on what we know this certainly is as much of a possibility as anything else suggested here.

Bullshit. I have two words: Valerie Plame. Cheney's henchman wanted her outed to screw over her husband and he had the press do his dirty work. What about that says the American Media is here to protect you?

The American Media is a puppet of the American Government which is why he chose a journalist from outside the country who could avoid pressure and threats from the American Government.

I don't claim to know what his motivations are, but I have yet to see a reason to question his motives. It wouldn't surprise me one bit to see him working closely with Assange and I'm not sure that would change anything.

Am I happy that a valuable intelligence resource has been outed? My response is ... Wait, what? Who the **** does the US Government think it is? The fact of the matter is that the US Government is taking liberties away from you and me and all you're worried about is this one guy who felt that you should know about it. One person stepping forward in a treasonous crime pales in comparison to the treasonous crimes being perpetuated by our Government and all anyone cares about is where this guys is and where he's headed next.

Where is the thread calling for the heads of our leaders who are running this scheme? Why are people more up in arms over the potential of two guys getting married, but no one gives a shit when the government starts collecting and storing our personal information secretly?

Seriously?

What we do know is that this program is illegal and it shouldn't have been running to begin with. I can't say that makes me upset because the NSA is upset. Next time you want to create an intelligence network, brush up on Constitutional Law and do it right.