Do you treat atheist like second class citizens?

of course. we agree kinda.

it is. in the same sense that knowing the world is round is superior to the flat earth position. in the same sense that 2+2=4 is superior to 2+2=5. even if your faith tells you that 2+2 is 5, that doesnt mean i shouldnt question it or be honest about how stupid you are being.

they are.

i didnt say i was your intellectual superior, i am saying your position on this is whacked.

 

that is nuts, god can do whatever he wants and he can make a flat earth appear spherical from your perspective. i find it disrespectful that you are questioning my faith.

if i cant prove my position then you cannot prove there is no santa. that is not some weak throwaway analogy. it is literally what i mean, the thing you cannot understand. read it again. if my position is weak then so is your anti-santa policy. there is no evidence that santa or god exists. none. so why do you believe in one and not the other? they are exactly the same. would you mock an adult that had faith in santa? you cant prove there is no santa!

give me an example of something you have mocked in your lifetime. now think if the person you had mocked had claimed that he was acting that way because of his faith. what would you do?

 

well, the "scientific" consensus, among scientists is pro-atheism, particularly the top tier scientists, who are overwhelmingly non-believers.

of course it doesnt matter either way, because truth doesnt come as the result of a vote.

according to which standard? yours? nobody gives a damn what you think is "true" christianity. you dont seem to get it. there is no such thing as "real" or "true" christianity. again, not to wear out the analogy, but this is like arguing that santa claus actually wore a blue suit, not a red one. you can say whatever you want, because there is no real objective reference point! the whole shebang is made up! thats why it is so absurd and frivolous and nonsensical and dangerous.

 

red has taught me another new word, "trenchant". i will be slowly incorporating it into the permanent rotation.

 

There is something that I think one needs to understand about the religious, and that is the majority of the religious do not think the Bible, Tara, or Koran are an absolute. We know, we are flawed, but the words of the Lord were written 1000’s of years ago and much has changed. What was civilized society then is not the same as what is civilized society now. Even the religious look at certain segments within their own and think them extremists. There are those of the cloth, that are looked to for guidance, there are those that are of the flock, that are the followers, and then there are those that are extreme. Those of the cloth try to live as closely to God as possible, those that are followers try to live as good as they can within our society and seek forgiveness of their shortcomings, those that are extreme do not necessarily reflect the views of either of the other 2.

Is it flawed, you bet, but it is an means to an order for people to live by. A means for a people to look to a greater being for guidance. A means for a people to form a civilized society. A foundation for a society to determine its rules and regulations. It has served civilized humanity several millennium and will continue to far into the future. Religion is the glue that keeps society civilized. Remove it and find out how disorderly society would become. There was a time when God did ask of man to kill and make sacrifices of the slain, in order to reach the gates of Heaven, but that was changed, for Christians at least, when God gave his son Jesus up for man’s crucifixion. Since that time, according to Christians, man has only to accept Jesus and God into their hearts.

Like science religion cannot be taken as an absolute, there are just way too many questions that are still unanswered. To me anyone that disregards one without the other isn’t looking at the complete picture. I don’t believe we will know, for an absolute, one way or the other. For now, to me, they both, religion and science, are dependent on each other. Neither has the complete answer and neither can completely disregard the other. If you were to ask me what I think, or do I believe that those of other denominations or even non faith are going to burn in hell for not believing as Christians do, I would tell you I don’t know for certain, but my belief is that those who believe in a higher being, a creator, someone to ask for guidance, be it God or Buda, or Abraham, or Allah, or the Tree and Sun God’s, etc I think that they will be given the time to spend eternity in whatever afterlife or heaven is. For those that are atheists, agnostic, or whatever non belief group they might fall into, I simply don’t know and won’t unless one of them dies and comes back and tells me.

For the record, I consider myself a very religious person. I have been of strong Christian faith my entire life and no I am not a fanatic or extreme. I believe in our Lord, I believe and have experienced many miracles that make me know that God and Jesus are in my heart and my life. I also know that there are explanations for the miracles that I am talking about, but without them having happened in my life I wouldn’t be where I am today. I thank God for family and friends and know that they are the foundation to my heart and soul.

Call me what you like, look at my point of view however you like, but it is my point of view. You don’t have to agree with it, you don’t have to like it, you can ridicule it all you like. I can tell you this, there is someone here that can confirm the miracles that I refer to, and even though they may not be seen as miracles to others, they are in my life. To some miracles must be seen or they must benefit all, but in reality miracles are what make each person’s life be fulfilled, be safe, be happy, healthy, and be. My greatest miracles are my children, and all the other miracles the lord has blessed me with are the gifts I Thank God everyday for.

Take my message however you like, but I can tell you from my own experience, I will look to our Lord everyday and thank our God for all his love.

 

sure, you really said nothing. you think it is awesome that your kids exist, and presumably you think they must have been created via magic or something. that's cool i guess. makes no sense at all, but yunno, good for you, hoss.

 

If you knew the story behind the births of my children you might see it a bit differently, but as even I stated I know there are logical explanations, meaning science. The fact that I have 3 healthy children is nothing short of a miracle though. Once again you open mouth insert foot, because you can't see past your own self.