Vote Now! California's water problem

Discussion in 'Free Speech Alley' started by LaSalleAve, Apr 2, 2015.

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Is the California drought a direct result of climate change?

  1. Well most climate scientists agree so yes

    3 vote(s)
    15.8%

  2. Wild guess yes

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%

  3. Yes you'd have to be an idiot to think it's not

    3 vote(s)
    15.8%

  4. No, climate change hasn't had anything to do with it

    1 vote(s)
    5.3%

  5. No there is not enough data to support this claim

    7 vote(s)
    36.8%

  6. No, Climate change is a hoax

    1 vote(s)
    5.3%

  7. Wild guess No

    4 vote(s)
    21.1%
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  1. LaSalleAve

    LaSalleAve when in doubt, mumble

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    Is it more dangerous than nuclear power plants?
     
    LaSalleAve, Apr 7, 2015
    #81
  2. red55

    red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

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    Actually, yes, it could be. Nuclear fission generates heat by radiation, which is kept under containment and has proven very safe. Hydrogen is extremely volatile and hard too handle. To manufacture water on industrial scales might require huge and near-continuous hydrogen conflagrations which would be hard to contain and subject to accidental explosions. The alternative would be a major breakthrough in fuel-cell technology which has a theoretical potential to produce both electricity and water.

    And there is never a free lunch. Hydrogen and oxygen are still consumed, there are costs involved in acquiring enough of it, and manufacturing enough of it on vast global scales may prove to be quite a challenge.

    We still need to pursue the research, but there are no easy answers.
     
    red55, Apr 8, 2015
    #82
  3. Winston1

    Winston1 Founding Member

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    Actually that is what fuel cells do; combine hydrogen and oxygen to generate electricity. The byproduct is pure water. Fuel cell have been used in space for decades. Many companies including Exxon (at one time anyway) are working on commercial applications. I think either Toyota or Honda claims to be close to production of a fuel cell powered electric car.
    As Red says there is a problem with the safe handling of hydrogen. Current designs use a light hydrocarbon that is treated with a catalyst to create H2. There are also other designs that try to store hydrogen in other safe ways. It isn't commercial yet and scaling it up to large scale is a challenge.
    As noted fuel cells are looked at as electrical generators but a large scale fuel cell farm may produce good amounts of pure H2O.
     
    Winston1, Apr 8, 2015
    #83
  4. red55

    red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

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    Just not efficient enough for industrial power production yet and it takes a lot of space. But research continues. Technical breakthroughs do happen.
     
    red55, Apr 8, 2015
    #84
  5. TwistedTiger

    TwistedTiger Founding Member

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    Fuel cell technology is very interesting, but I'm not sure we're any where close to being a viable option even on a limited scale. Hydrogen is indeed volital but can be handled safely even on a large scale. It's done on a daily basis.
     
    TwistedTiger, Apr 11, 2015
    #85
  6. uscvball

    uscvball Founding Member

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    I think that's fair and close enough. And perhaps more of a Constitutionalist.

    Getting back to the water sitch....the price of certain fruits/lettuce/some veggies is going to skyrocket if something doesn't change quickly.
     
    uscvball, Apr 11, 2015
    #86
  7. LaSalleAve

    LaSalleAve when in doubt, mumble

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    Pot too
     
    LaSalleAve, Apr 11, 2015
    #87
  8. TwistedTiger

    TwistedTiger Founding Member

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    Quit being such a Democrat, waiting for someone to provide for your needs and grow your own.
     
    TwistedTiger, Apr 12, 2015
    #88
    Bengal B likes this.
  9. gyver

    gyver Rely on yourself not on others.

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    gyver, Apr 12, 2015
    #89
  10. red55

    red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

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    California's water supply problem is not caused by environmental regulation to protect the smelt. The endangered species is just a straw man for opposition to dealing with myriad environmental problems in the Sacramento Delta which is in bad shape due to a century of placer gold mining upstream that clogged it with sediment and a century of irrigation in the Valley that clogged it with agricultural chemical runoff. It is important to millions of people (not just thousands of fish) that the delta provide drinking water and seafood habitat. But this is completely beside the point.

    The reason that California is in crisis is a severe drought compounded by a century of poor water management. The reservoirs are almost dry. The smelt in the estuary did not cause a drought in the mountains.

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    red55, Apr 12, 2015
    #90
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