i am not gonna call you names, but i am gonna join bengal b in admitting i have no idea what agape love is.
A very common word for love during the apostolic age was philia. It is the word of genuine affection – heart love. It is seen in the name, Philadelphia (brotherly love). Jesus had this kind of love for his closest disciple, John (John 20:2), and for Lazarus (John 11:3). The noblest form of love, however, was agape. William Barclay, in his superb discussion of this word, noted that “Agape has to do with the mind: it is not simply an emotion which rises unbidden in our hearts; it is a principle by which we deliberately live” (New Testament Words, p. 21). It is the kind of love that we must have for all men – even our enemies (Matt. 5:44). The Christian must always act out of love, i.e., in the best interest of his fellow human beings.
Agape love is love which has no limitations. It is total in that nothing could make you feel ill will toward another or make you hurt them. It is the love we are to have as Jesus Christ taught and lived. "Love thy neighbor as thyself." "Do unto others---". Agape love is loving one's enemies, no matter what they do to you, no matter how bad they hurt you. Agape love is pure and total forgiveness of others as God forgives us. To have agape love is to be glad Terry Nichols and Tim McVeigh repented. To have agape love is to mourn the fact that the 9/11 hijackers will probably suffer in Hell for eternity. To have agape love for your fellow man is to not take joy in his suffering nor wish further punishment upon him. To have agape love is to love one another as Jesus loves us. That we are willing to die for our fellow man, no matter who or what he is. Any person who claims to be a Christian and does not hold to these values is a traitor to his faith, or has no faith. This is what Jesus taught and it is what He expects, no commands, us to live. To do otherwise is to reject Him.
a lot of christians, it seems to me like they dont even know what they are doing. i was brought up going to sunday school, studying the bible every sunday. i know what christianity is about, and what it means. part of the reason i started to lose faith in christianity was that basically everyone who claimed to be christian was a hypocrite, and only wanted to feel like they would go to heaven or whatever, but didnt really have respect for the religion, or any commitment to its tenets, picking and choosing what parts to care about and basically making a mockery of the whole thing. the one thing i can say about mikethetiger69, even though i couldnt disagree more with his faith, is that he really sticks to it like he means it. and that is a rarity.
I tried the google search like Bengal does. does this make me a discple? :shock: anyway Mike's definition obviously envokes some of his religious beliefs and while I agree with them somewhat, the actual Definition would appear to be a tad less radical. Possibly just quibbling over terms here but I think it means Un reciprocated, more so than un conditional. For if it was un conditional, a sin could enter heaven and no one would perish, this goes agaisnt the teachings in the Bible. Various different types of love exist. Dignity is a self love. Friendship is a simple love. Family can be a lifetime of love. You can love by helping your neighbor. Anything you share is love. You can share time, goals, problems, activities. You can love your children or parents. You can love for a lifetime, or you can show a little loving friendship for a moment. Anytime you share with another, you are expressing love. That is the commonality. Opinions vary on how to define goodness or good love: love between family members: parent's love of children, etc. love of friends romantic love sexual love, also called lust, loving one another in general, helping the homeless, or a wounded animal loving something abstract or inanimate, like an idea or goal loving one's principles, one's nation or home country (patriotism), one's life (dignity), one's honor and independence (integrity) loving God or one's Ishta-Deva (chosen deity), also called devotion Some languages, such as ancient Greek, are better than the English at distinguishing between the different senses in which the word love is used. For example, ancient Greek has the words philia, eros, agape, and storge, meaning love between friends, romantic/sexual love, unconditional (possibly sacrificial, unreciprocated) love, and affection/familial love respectively. However, with Greek as with many other languages, it has been historically difficult to separate the meanings of these words totally, and so we can find examples of agape being used with much the same meaning as eros. At the same time the ancient Greek text of the Bible has examples of the verb agapo being used with the same meaning as phileo.
Thank you, Martin. That is a compliment I will cherish. I figured that your above stated reasons were probably why you feel the way you do toward religion. It is why I stopped going to church and practicing my faith as well. Although I never went so far as to completely stop believing as you have, I did break away for about 20 yrs. I thought I could live as you are now, on my own and for myself. I let the ways and thoughts of others turn me away from God. But then one day I realized that my relationship with Him is not based on what others do or think, it is based on what I do and think. Each of us has a personal relationship with Him and we are going to be accountable only for that. It is like donating to charity. My responsibility is to give what I can when I can. Jesus said, " The poor will always be with you." and He holds us accountable to help them. If the charity is fraudulent and misuses the money, then they will have to face the music but my obligation is fulfilled. If I ignore that obligation, then I am no better than they are and I will be judged equally. Likewise with the preachers and members of my church. God is not going to judge me by what they do but by what I do. I certainly hope that in all of my replies to you that I have never been judgemental and critical. If I have I apologize. I assure you it was never my intent and i don't intend to now. With that said, I would hope that, if your above stated reasons are truly the reasons for your un-belief, you would consider what I have said here and read the NT passages concerning Jesus ' criticism and statements on hypocrites and His feelings towards them. You might be surprised to find you have a lot in common. I promise you I am not trying to preach to you or convert you. I just want to give you a little food for thought and based on things you have said about your unhappiness at the thought of this being all there is, it might open a little window into reviving what you have given up for dead. I only say this to you because I have walked in your shoes, to a certain extent. So if you will, just give it a look. You have nothing to lose but a little time. And JS, I certainly never meant to imply that Gods'/Jesus' love for us is "unconditional". What I meant was that no matter what we did, or how bad it is, if we truly repented, we would receive forgiveness, that it would not be held against us. Also that God loves us so much, He would never allow us to come to harm in any way if we obeyed Him. This is not to say that bad things will never befall us, because they will but we will know they are meant for a positive reason, such as to make our faith stronger, as in Job. The main thing we have to remember about the love of God for us is that what happens on this Earth is of little or no importance. It is what he has planned AFTER we leave here that counts and His love is such that He gave His only Son to protect us from that ultimate misfortune, eternity in Hell. As Martin stated above, and rightly so, the majority of people, whatever their religion, are hypocrites, choosing what and when they will do what their religion calls for. With agape love, you do it all, regardless of the cost to you.
I refuse to donate to organized charities because I know that 90% of the money goes toward raising more money or toward administrative costs. Out of the money given to the United Way for 9/11 victims the UW gave $75,000 to some symphony orchestra and spent $80,000 redecorating the office of the head of UW.
Then I think it safe to assume that you don't donate to anyone or anything because I am sure your stance regarding the fellow on the corner holding a "Will work for food" sign or someone at the homeless shelter is "Get out and get a job, you lazy bum!" I'm sure that with your vast knowledge of each and every situation that you are the perfect judge of who should or should not receive help. And go ahead folks, let's hear your sarcastic pleas for aid from me. But let's make them original and funny or don't bother, okay?
I once knew a guy who would stand on a corner with a Work for Food sign every day until he got enough money for his daily cocaine habit. Since he looked like an ax murderer even the most guilt driven liberal wouldn't have actually brought him to their homes to do some work because then he would have known where they lived. One time I was pulling into the parking lot returning to work after a break. A male bum and his female bum partner approached me and the guy said that his old lady hadn't eaten in a week. It so happened that we had had an office Christmas party that day and there was lots of food still in the office so I offered to go up and fix them both a big plate of food. The bum's response? He told me to "Go F**K Myself" Somehow I think they really just wanted money for drugs. I am the perfect judge of who I am willing to help. Maybe you are so rich that you can afford to hand out money indesciminatly to everybody with their hand out but I'm not. Humor helps. Once a bum asked me for a dollar at a convienience store. I asked him what he wanted the money for. He said he wanted it to buy some wine. Since he didn't lie to me and since he told a couple of jokes I gave him $5.
